# Blocked airspace



## ICE (Jan 1, 2014)

The usual treatment when the enclosure is placer over a hole is to seal around the enclosure with silicone or epoxy.





http://www.flickr.com/photos/97859466@N05/11694025904/ [/URL]



> 312.2 Damp and Wet Locations. In damp or wet locations, surface-type enclosures within the scope of this article shall be placed or equipped so as to prevent moisture or water from entering and accumulating within the cabinet or cutout box, and *shall be mounted so there is at least ¼-in. airspace between the enclosure and the wall or other supporting surface.* ............


The air space is still there, albeit blocked, but still there.  Understanding that the hole is it's own violation, would you consider it a violation to seal around the enclosure?

The solar contractor has a C-10 license so he was able to pull a permit to perform a service upgrade.  The small enclosure was existing.  There is no dead-front for the small enclosure yet they assumed that since it is existing, it can stay that way.







http://www.flickr.com/photos/97859466@N05/11694590694/

I find it tiresome to write a long list of corrections when it starts with do it over....somewhere else.  Furthermore, I will most likely never see this crew again and the next bunch will do just as bad if not worse.


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## MASSDRIVER (Jan 1, 2014)

Is the intent that there will be a conduit, or several, that penetrates a finished wall, seal that in the hole, then the conduit seals watertight to the enclosure, then standoff the enclosure from the finished surface when mounting it up?

Brent.


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## ICE (Jan 2, 2014)

MASSDRIVER said:
			
		

> Is the intent that there will be a conduit, or several, that penetrates a finished wall, seal that in the hole, then the conduit seals watertight to the enclosure, then standoff the enclosure from the finished surface when mounting it up?Brent.


That might work.  If there were no cable or splices, the conduit is secured and sealed to the wall....the inspector was willing to take your word for it.





http://www.flickr.com/photos/97859466@N05/11695754195/[/URL]






http://www.flickr.com/photos/97859466@N05/11696049574/

It's not always easy to spot.






http://www.flickr.com/photos/97859466@N05/11696324973/

But if you look closely, the signs are there.












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## Mech (Jan 2, 2014)

> Furthermore, I will most likely never see this crew again and the next bunch will do just as bad if not worse.


ICE - When issuing a permit, perhaps your building department should hand out pictures of these failed installations so the party performing the work will know what has been constructed, inspected, and rejected.  If they duplicate the error, the re-inspection fee is higher than normal. Other the other hand, maybe they should read and follow the code.


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## ICE (Jan 2, 2014)

Mech said:
			
		

> ICE - When issuing a permit, perhaps your building department should hand out pictures of these failed installations so the party performing the work will know what has been constructed, inspected, and rejected.  If they duplicate the error, the re-inspection fee is higher than normal. Other the other hand, maybe they should read and follow the code.


My dept. would rather that I not write the corrections.


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## retire09 (Jan 3, 2014)

It is my understanding that the 1/4" gap is to allow water running down the wall to not be trapped and allows the rear of the enclosure to stay dry.

Any moisture that might become trapped will rot out the back of the panel.

A surface mounted panel should not be recessed or sealed in a way that the 1/4" gap is closed.


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## ICE (Jan 3, 2014)

retire09 said:
			
		

> It is my understanding that the 1/4" gap is to allow water running down the wall to not be trapped and allows the rear of the enclosure to stay dry.Any moisture that might become trapped will rot out the back of the panel.
> 
> A surface mounted panel should not be recessed or sealed in a way that the 1/4" gap is closed.


The sides and top are sealed but not the bottom.  Water that gets in has a gravity way out.  Well except if there is a hole in the wall, in which case the water can get into the wall.

Remember that the hole is reason enough to write a violation.

I had a guy do this.  He cut a hole in a bedroom wall and did a neat job of it.  There is no gaping hole....no splices





http://www.flickr.com/photos/97859466@N05/10484238323/ [/URL]

This is the enclosure side.






http://www.flickr.com/photos/97859466@N05/11720526604/

The sides and top of the enclosure are sealed with silicone.  

How would you proceed from here.


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## retire09 (Jan 3, 2014)

If you had enough conductor length and do not need to spice anything in the old panel, could you leave the old panel cover on and srew it shut and nipple out of the old cover into the back of the new panel below the bussing?


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## ICE (Jan 3, 2014)

retire09 said:
			
		

> If you had enough conductor length and do not need to spice anything in the old panel, could you leave the old panel cover on and srew it shut and nipple out of the old cover into the back of the new panel below the bussing?


The old enclosure would then be a pull box and a pull box shall remain accessible....so no that would not work


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## retire09 (Jan 3, 2014)

Could you LB out of the front of the old panel and into the side of the new?


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## MASSDRIVER (Jan 3, 2014)

The problem is this:

To do it correctly is a multi-day effort because of the processes. Remove and prep old work, repair and restucco-reside to match, replace with new service.

Blow and go does not lend itself well to this, and power may be off for more than a day.

They are trying to get in and out from 9-5. Probably less.

Brent


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## steveray (Jan 3, 2014)

"They are trying to get in and out from 9-5. Probably less."

They should be doing 5-10...Maybe more for work like that....


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## Mech (Jan 3, 2014)

> They should be doing 5-10...Maybe more for work like that....


You are referring to jail time, right?


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## steveray (Jan 3, 2014)

Mech said:
			
		

> You are referring to jail time, right?


Yes...severely joking...but yes......That is, until they kill someone via fire or electrocution.....Then it's the Hamurrabi smackdown!

We now return you to serious code based discussion......


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## chris kennedy (Jan 3, 2014)

MASSDRIVER said:
			
		

> To do it correctly is a multi-day effort because of the processes.


Agreed......


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## ICE (Jan 4, 2014)

retire09 said:
			
		

> Could you LB out of the front of the old panel and into the side of the new?


As long as the door of the old enclosure can be removed to access what would then be a J-box..... without removing the LB.

Here's one that I ran into today.  I felt like telling then that they need a bigger enclosure.


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## ICE (Jan 11, 2014)

Happens nine times out of ten.





http://www.flickr.com/photos/97859466@N05/11889595493/ [/URL]






http://www.flickr.com/photos/97859466@N05/11889728544/

And don't bother telling me about sticking a bare #8 in the hole.


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