# Bonding & W/C Survey



## Alias (Dec 16, 2011)

How many jurisdictions require proof of bonding and/or Workers Comp before issuing a permit?

1.  Yes for all projects

2.  No for all projects

3.  Yes for all Commercial projects

4.  Yes for large Commercial projects ($500,000 +)

5.  Yes for all residential including individual single family

6.  Yes for all multi-family, subdivisions, and PUD residential

Thanks in advance for your responses.

I am attempting to clarify a gray area in code - City, maybe CBC.  I have some contractors balking at providing a statement from their insurance company stating that they do indeed have the required insurance to contract in CA.

The reason I am asking is that in the past I have always asked for the information when they came in for a permit and applied for a city business license (City Clerk).  I have since found out that it is not in City Code.  I am now trying to develop policy.


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## mtlogcabin (Dec 16, 2011)

2. No for all projects

When I worked in Fl it was part of there contractors liscense. The county was named certificate holders on their WC insurance. When we where notified of WC cancellation we shut them down.

State law required Bonds on goverment projects over a certain value.


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## gbhammer (Dec 16, 2011)

We do not require a GC to be bonded.

We do require that the individual trades maintain a bond and provide proof of CEU's.

Section 22  Security and Insurance Required.

A.	Security Requirements.

1.	The security shall be conditioned upon faithful compliance with this Building Code and shall be in the amount of twenty-five thousand dollars ($25,000).

2.	The security shall be placed on file with the Code Enforcement Division and shall be in one of the following forms:

a.	A bond, payable to Jefferson County and issued by an institution authorized to issue such bonds in this state;

3.	After the opportunity for a hearing and upon determination by the Code Commission that a Contractor has failed to construct, modify or repair a system in compliance with this Building Code, the Code Official shall notify the Contractor that its security may be claimed and the moneys placed with Jefferson County, if the system is not in brought into compliance with this Building Code within thirty (30) days of the notice.

Section 23  Certificate of Liability Insurance Requirements.

1.	Certificate of liability insurance with a ten day cancellation clause

2.	$1,000,000 aggregate limit

3.	$250,000 per occurrence limit


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## Papio Bldg Dept (Dec 16, 2011)

Alias said:
			
		

> How many jurisdictions require proof of bonding and/or Workers Comp before issuing a permit?





			
				Alias said:
			
		

> 2.  No for all projects


...much to my shagrin.  "Bonding?!?  Insurance?!?  You want to talk bonding?!?!"  Not even a hint of a registration or licensing program either.  We do require their address and phone number though.   



			
				Alias said:
			
		

> I am now trying to develop policy.


I would be interested to see what you come with.


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## mjesse (Dec 16, 2011)

2. None required.

No contractor registration required.

plumbers and roofers are required to be licensed with the State.

mj


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## gbhammer (Dec 16, 2011)

Papio Bldg Dept said:
			
		

> ...much to my shagrin.  "Bonding?!?  Insurance?!?  You want to talk bonding?!?!"  Not even a hint of a registration or licensing program either.  We do require their address and phone number though.    I would be interested to see what you come with.


Do you call the number to make sure it works before you issue the permit?


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## ewenme (Dec 16, 2011)

In Idaho the State requires bonding/insurance for the trades [HVAC/Plumbing/Electrical] and licensure. The State requires Contractor Registration and bonding/insurance. Not up to the local jurisdictions.

Carol


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## Papio Bldg Dept (Dec 16, 2011)

gbhammer said:
			
		

> Do you call the number to make sure it works before you issue the permit?


Permit?  The work is usually done before we get a permit.  Front page of our paper was an interview of a furniture re-seller who had just hung a shingle here in our fair city...unbeknownst to us.  CEO said today the cash register was already up and running and the 1800sf were filled with "stuff."  Just had a nice couple in this afternoon getting a permit for work that already shows up on our GIS.

Shirley, I don't know when I would have time to make that call.


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## gbhammer (Dec 16, 2011)

I love it when the permit hits my desk and I have no contact information at all. That is one of the reasons we are starting to collect fees up front for review.


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## fatboy (Dec 17, 2011)

#2, although our HVAC license requires a $1000 surety bond on the license itself. Other than that, have at it.


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## permitguy (Dec 17, 2011)

Whew!  I couldn't for the life of me figure out why someone was trying to remove a difference of potential from their toilet.   

I've worked for a jurisdiction that required proof of liability and worker's comp insurance, with the jurisdiction listed as a certificate holder so they would receive notice of cancellation.  This was a condition of receiving a business license as a contractor and did not apply to property owners doing work on their own residence.


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## Alias (Dec 17, 2011)

Thanks for all the good input.

Contractors here are required to provide this info to the state to get a contractor's license.  I am going to drop this and just go with what is listed on the statr's CSLB website.  Former admin was the one that always bugged them for the info and got it.  I don't need another file in the filing cabinet.


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## ICE (Dec 17, 2011)

Our permit form has a section devoted to workers comp.  The applicant states that there are no employees and therefor they are exempt from W/C or they provide a copy of the policy verification.  When I show up for inspection and there are six workman and no insurance, I am not supposed to react because we don't enforce CSLB regulations.


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## Alias (Dec 19, 2011)

ICE said:
			
		

> Our permit form has a section devoted to workers comp.  The applicant states that there are no employees and therefor they are exempt from W/C or they provide a copy of the policy verification.  When I show up for inspection and there are six workman and no insurance, I am not supposed to react because we don't enforce CSLB regulations.


tiger -

Yeah, I have that blurb about w/c on my permit application.  Ours reads "I have, placed on file with the City of Alturas Building Depart., a Certificate of Worker's Compensation Insurance or a Certificate of Consent to Self-Insure."

As to employees, boy, don't I know that one!  Especially with our local religious groups that do contracting.  Show up one day and there are a couple, two days later it's a dozen including a minor or two.  Pssst.....state labor law doesn't allow under 18 on a construction site.  That was an interesting 'heads up' when I told the contractor that item.


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## gbhammer (Dec 19, 2011)

Watch out Sue you may be walking on thin ice over the flame'n pit with a chance for excommunication.


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## gbhammer (Dec 19, 2011)

We don't require the GC to be licensed so not that big of a deal here. As far as kids working, well we don't inspect on the weekends.


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## steveray (Dec 19, 2011)

We are required by the State to get proof of Workers comp or a waiver.....stupid.....I have a 76 yr old plumber doing all of the work for an asian buffet restaraunt...by himself as a sole proprietor..cause he filled out a "waiver"....what a joke...


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## TJacobs (Dec 19, 2011)

Same as mjesse (#2)


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## ICE (Dec 19, 2011)

Alias said:
			
		

> As to employees, boy, don't I know that one!  Especially with our local religious groups that do contracting.


Religious groups are exempt from any requirement to obtain a permit.  If you don't want to take my word for it, just ask any religious group.

A church that I attended was installing six package units on a classroom building without permits and I left a stop work notice.  The pastor showed up at the counter the next morning.  He knew me and was instantly upset that I hadn't previously informed him that I work for the government.  He then insisted that his church is exempt from getting permits.  I disagreed and told him to send in licensed contractors to obtain permits and don't forget the engineering for the additional roof load.  He thinks he sent me to Hell.


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## mtlogcabin (Dec 19, 2011)

ICE said:
			
		

> Religious groups are exempt from any requirement to obtain a permit. If you don't want to take my word for it, just ask any religious group. A church that I attended was installing six package units on a classroom building without permits and I left a stop work notice. The pastor showed up at the counter the next morning. He knew me and was instantly upset that I hadn't previously informed him that I work for the government. He then insisted that his church is exempt from getting permits. I disagreed and told him to send in licensed contractors to obtain permits and don't forget the engineering for the additional roof load. He thinks he sent me to Hell.


That's when you quote

I Peter Chapter 2 Verse13

Submit yourselves to every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake: whether it be to the king, as supreme; 

Oh don't forget to tell them that is the King James version


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## Papio Bldg Dept (Dec 20, 2011)

ICE said:
			
		

> Religious groups are exempt from any requirement to obtain a permit.  If you don't want to take my word for it, just ask any religious group.  A church that I attended was installing six package units on a classroom building without permits and I left a stop work notice.  The pastor showed up at the counter the next morning.  He knew me and was instantly upset that I hadn't previously informed him that I work for the government.  He then insisted that his church is exempt from getting permits.  I disagreed and told him to send in licensed contractors to obtain permits and don't forget the engineering for the additional roof load.  He thinks he sent me to Hell.


This sounds familiar to some of my experiences.  We still have one where they refuse to call us for inspections.  Turns out their 1 hour assembly wasn't drywalled to the bottom of deck, and the door they used didn't have a listed rating and the hardware had been removed and installed in a new location leaving holes in the door.  Funtimes.


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## Alias (Dec 20, 2011)

ICE said:
			
		

> Religious groups are exempt from any requirement to obtain a permit.  If you don't want to take my word for it, just ask any religious group.  A church that I attended was installing six package units on a classroom building without permits and I left a stop work notice.  The pastor showed up at the counter the next morning.  He knew me and was instantly upset that I hadn't previously informed him that I work for the government.  He then insisted that his church is exempt from getting permits.  I disagreed and told him to send in licensed contractors to obtain permits and don't forget the engineering for the additional roof load.  He thinks he sent me to Hell.


These religious groups here have contractors licenses and do large commercial projects in town.  One does stellar work, the other brothers are, well, a bit challenging........  On the plus side, they are improving.


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## Alias (Dec 20, 2011)

gbhammer said:
			
		

> Watch out Sue you may be walking on thin ice over the flame'n pit with a chance for excommunication.


Well, guess I just have to take that chance.      LOL


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## righter101 (Dec 23, 2011)

We will not issue a permit without verifying a licensed contrator is listed for the project.  This verification would cover bonding and WC.

State of Washington here.

As far as religious folks claiming to not need any permits, in our jurisdiction, it is farmers that think they don't have to obey any rules.


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## gbhammer (Dec 23, 2011)

:wstupid "Were agricultural we don't have to get permits."


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## gbhammer (Dec 23, 2011)

My favorite was: "What do you mean I need a permit for my 20,000 sq. ft. riding arena? It's agricultural you can't make me get a permit! Of course it's for my personal use. I need that parking lot for my horse trailer, and if my friends come over. What do you mean it's in a flood way? I will sue you if you try and make me take it down!"


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## Pcinspector1 (Dec 24, 2011)

Workman's comp. is part of the city's business license requirement, if the company is on the BL list they have WC and I can issue a permit.

pc1


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## righter101 (Dec 29, 2011)

gbhammer said:
			
		

> My favorite was: "What do you mean I need a permit for my 20,000 sq. ft. riding arena? It's agricultural you can't make me get a permit! Of course it's for my personal use. I need that parking lot for my horse trailer, and if my friends come over. What do you mean it's in a flood way? I will sue you if you try and make me take it down!"


Sounds strangely similar to a case we have ongoing here.


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## Architect1281 (Dec 29, 2011)

Require Contractor registration or MEP License only

really have no concern about performance / surety or contractural obligations between

owner and contractors , we are inspectors not lawywers


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