# Over Drilled Stud w/picture



## Mule (Nov 3, 2011)

Originally a 2X4 wall with 2" pvc running through the stud.

I issued a red tag. Install stud shoe.

Here is what they did!

The contractor added a 2X6 beside the 2X4 and drilled through the 2X6.







Issued another red tag. Contractor asked.... Why? It's not over bored!

What is the answer?


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## georgia plans exam (Nov 3, 2011)

The edge of the hole is closer than 5/8" to edge of stud?

GPE


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## atomahutna (Nov 3, 2011)

Looks like an exterior bearing wall, so notch in the 2x6 can not exteed 25% of width, or about 1 1/4 ".


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## Yankee (Nov 3, 2011)

untreated 2x6 foot bearing on concrete


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## ICE (Nov 3, 2011)

What does the wall support?

I would think that if the two studs are stitch nailed, the fix works for a single story bearing wall.  A few A35 clips wouldn't hurt.  Two story is engineer's territory so I would let her decide.

Lacking engineering, stud shoes are only good for partition walls and if this is a partition wall it's overbuilt.

Then again, maybe Mule is asking a trick question and I missed it.  Maybe it's plumbing.  The holes do appear to be too small for the pipe.  Too much purple primer?     I take it to be a washer standpipe.  Could it be that it daylights above grade?  The fitting above the san-tee looks odd but that's probably an optical illusion.  I am usually on the other side of these teases, this is fun.


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## Mule (Nov 4, 2011)

The main answer I was looking for was................................

Drum roll please.................................



			
				Yankee said:
			
		

> untreated 2x6 foot bearing on concrete


The edge of the hole is closer than 5/8" to edge of stud?

GPE

GPE......It was before the addition of the 2X6.  Which leads to another question. Is that 5/8" required from bothe sides of the studs or just the interior side where drywall will be attached?

atom...the stud was drilled so the 25% rule is not in question.

ICE.... I can't let you have all the fun!!! This was the first time I have been out in the field in a long time.....sort-of scares me when I find stuff like this going on because that leads me to believe my inspector may be missing this stuff!

Single story....bearing wall....didn't realize that stud shoes are only good for partition walls...huuummmmm. No plumbing issues on this picture.

Thanks for the comments. Like I said..couldn't let Tiger have all the fun!


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## Pcinspector1 (Nov 4, 2011)

Is the wall on concrete, like yankee sez, need treated sole plate.

"got purple primer?"

atomahutna, Holes, 40% or 60%, see figure R602.6 (1) and R606.2 (2) depending if this wall is bearing or not.

pc1


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## georgia plans exam (Nov 4, 2011)

I would say that the 5/8" rule applies to both edges of the studs. Thanks, Mule.

GPE


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## High Desert (Nov 4, 2011)

I believe the code permits stud shoes on bearing walls.


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## David Henderson (Nov 4, 2011)

There are 2 types of stud shoes, bearing (HSS) and non-bearing (SS) according to Simpson, for single, double, and tripple studs.


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## Yankee (Nov 4, 2011)

georgia plans exam said:
			
		

> I would say that the 5/8" rule applies to both edges of the studs. Thanks, Mule.GPE


I enforce nail plates both side because someday there will be nails getting driven from the outside . . .re-siding, whatever. And isn't the distance required 1 1/2"?


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## georgia plans exam (Nov 4, 2011)

Max 5/8" R602.6 2006 IRC, min 1 1/4" (or nail plates are required) 300.4(A)(1) 2008 NEC.

GPE


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## Yankee (Nov 4, 2011)

I guess I have never come across one that is that close to the edge, always back where is isn't quite 1 1/2" : )


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## mtlogcabin (Nov 4, 2011)

> The main answer I was looking for was................................Drum roll please.................................
> 
> 
> 
> ...


R317.1 Location required.

Protection of wood and wood based products from decay shall be provided in the following locations by the use of naturally durable wood or wood that is preservative-treated in accordance with AWPA U1 for the species, product, preservative and end use. Preservatives shall be listed in Section 4 of AWPA U1.

1. Wood joists or the bottom of a wood structural floor when closer than 18 inches (457 mm) or wood girders when closer than 12 inches (305 mm) to the exposed ground in crawl spaces or unexcavated area located within the periphery of the building foundation.

2. All wood framing members that rest on concrete or masonry exterior foundation walls and are less than 8 inches (203 mm) from the exposed ground. Might be above 8 inches above exposed ground

3. Sills and sleepers on a concrete or masonry slab that is in direct contact with the ground unless separated from such slab by an impervious moisture barrier. Is an impervious moisture barrier installed below the slab?


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## Mule (Nov 4, 2011)

mtlogcabin said:
			
		

> 2. All wood framing members that rest on concrete or masonry exterior foundation walls and are less than 8 inches (203 mm) from the exposed ground. Might be above 8 inches above exposed ground!


Not at this one.



			
				mtlogcabin said:
			
		

> 3. Sills and sleepers on a concrete or masonry slab that is in direct contact with the ground unless separated from such slab by an impervious moisture barrier. Is an impervious moisture barrier installed below the slab?


Yes there is a moisture barrier however I was leaning more toward the stud must rest completely on the sole plate.

R602.3.4 Bottom (sole) plate. Studs shall have full bearing on

a nominal 2-by (51 mm) or larger plate or sill having a width at

least equal to the width of the studs.


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## mtlogcabin (Nov 4, 2011)

> I was leaning more toward the stud must rest completely on the sole plate.


Agree with that


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## Rio (Nov 5, 2011)

How 'bout slapping an A34 or something along those lines to the horizontal member below and then 16d's @ 8" o.c. from that member to the sill plate?


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## ICE (Nov 5, 2011)

High Desert said:
			
		

> I believe the code permits stud shoes on bearing walls.


You are correct.

R602.6 Allows stud shoes with an exception.  The HSS is good for a 1200# load, which is plenty.  It doesn't look as if there is room for the HSS but the SS is good for 500#.

The way I read it, stud shoes are an exception to the requirement for a doubled stud where an exterior or bearing partition stud has been drilled between 40% and 60%.

60% of a 2"x4" is 2 1/8".

2" schedule 40 PVC has an OD of 2 3/8". The hole required for 2" PVC is 2 1/2", with room for movement and slope, which is required, but there's no point in getting worked up over a trap arm for a clothes washer so 2 3/8" it is.

A hole that is less than 5/8" from the edge is a notch.

A 2 1/2" hole leaves less than 5/8" on each side and is a severed stud.

Well that's per code and an 1/8" here and a 1/4" there happens all the time.  Repetitive members make up for our poor eyesight.

Being practical, Mule was right and a stud shoe would have worked in this case.


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## Daddy-0- (Nov 5, 2011)

He kicked like a MULE and he bit like a crocodile......

(Boy named Sue..... Johnny Cash)


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## fireguy (Nov 5, 2011)

Isn't the GC normally responsible for increasing the stud to a 2 x 6?  Or is this a remodel?  Even if this is a plumbing remodel only, the plumber should know the thickness of the wall, right?


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## JBI (Nov 5, 2011)

I'm a bit confused about the sole plate. Was there NOT a 2 x 4 PT plate under the original wall?

At the base of the added 2 x 6 studs, they have been notched around what appears to be a 2 x 6 PT on edge leaving the remaining +\- 4" to bear on the original sole plate below. So the newly added 2 x 6 plain lumber would be bearing its' full depth on PT, wouldn't it? Unorthodox, but creative.


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## Mule (Nov 7, 2011)

JBI said:
			
		

> I'm a bit confused about the sole plate. Was there NOT a 2 x 4 PT plate under the original wall? At the base of the added 2 x 6 studs, they have been notched around what appears to be a 2 x 6 PT on edge leaving the remaining +\- 4" to bear on the original sole plate below. So the newly added 2 x 6 plain lumber would be bearing its' full depth on PT, wouldn't it? Unorthodox, but creative.


Well I guess creativly speaking... yes it complies. Just a weird way to get there.


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