# 903.2.11.1.3 basement sprinkler requirements



## mtlogcabin (Dec 18, 2014)

[F] 903.2.11.1.3 Basements.

Where any portion of a basement is located more than 75 feet (22 860 mm) from openings required by Section 903.2.11.1, or where walls, partitions or other obstructions are installed that restrict the application of water from hose streams, the basement shall be equipped throughout with an approved automatic sprinkler system.

The highlighted section is new. I have read the commentary and have not quite got my head rapped around when the requirement kicks in.

anybody care to offer a scenario or two.


----------



## JBI (Dec 18, 2014)

Underground parking garage with substantial concrete columns; basements that are partitioned.

That' 2.


----------



## fatboy (Dec 18, 2014)

"or where walls, partitions or other obstructions"

If you have _*any*_ interior wall in the basement, the sprinkler requirement triggers. That's how we are reading it


----------



## cda (Dec 18, 2014)

fatboy said:
			
		

> "or where walls, partitions or other obstructions"If you have _*any*_ interior wall in the basement, the sprinkler requirement triggers. That's how we are reading it


not sure that makes since?


----------



## cda (Dec 18, 2014)

so it looks like it changed from the 09 to the 12.

Does anyone have access to the change proposed to the 2012??


----------



## fatboy (Dec 18, 2014)

To me the idea is the fire folks don't want to try and fight a basement fire around or through walls, if it is wide open, their hose stream can knock it down. JMHO

If you have the time and patience you can go back through the archives on  the ICC site, they have all the gyrations for each code adoption, it's just a pain to get through.


----------



## north star (Dec 18, 2014)

*= & = & =*



My WAG is:

In reading through some of NFPA 13, ...[ IMO  ] it seems to be a dimensional requirement.

I haven't located specific language that states that, but seemingly it is somewhere

between 50 - 75 ft. of an approved hose stream............Any obstructions within that

50 - 75 ft. range would require an approved, alternative sprinkler design for those

spaces [  *RE:* NFPA 13, Ch. 21 - Alternative Sprinkler Designs For Ch. 12 Through 20   ].

I'm still looking tho'...



*= & = & =*


----------



## FM William Burns (Dec 18, 2014)

Fatboy has a pretty good handle on it.  Subterranean spaces present very difficult challenging fire scenarios due to the lack of ventilation and high temperature developing conditions due to the lack of abilities to reduce them through natural or positive pressure ventilation.  Having occupancies where subterranean compartments are created also present difficulties in rescue and survival.  Many firefighters have lost their lives in basements with our most recent in Philly the other day.  Hose stretches into subterranean spaces of greater than 50' decrease the rescue potential.  Fire spread in confined spaces without hose stream advancement abilities can also bring the entire structure down.  This was a successful initiative driven by the fire service representation in the code development process I believe.


----------



## cda (Dec 18, 2014)

north star said:
			
		

> *= & = & =*
> 
> My WAG is:
> 
> ...


Don't think you will find it


----------



## cda (Dec 18, 2014)

Do if you have a basement 30 feet from an opening no sprinklers required

But if you put up one wall that obstructs the spray you have to sprinkle it???


----------



## north star (Dec 18, 2014)

*+ & + & +*





> "But if you put up one wall that obstructs the spray you have to sprinkle it???"


Spray from what if no sprinklers are required ?*+ & + & +*


----------



## mtlogcabin (Dec 18, 2014)

FM

Here is a scenario

1400 sq ft 28 X 50 basement with no windows. Door and stair at the 50 ft end other end has water heater and HVAC equipment. No sprinklers required.

Right before CO owner wants to install a wall and create a "mechanical room". Now he has to install a fire suppression system throughout the basement?


----------



## fatboy (Dec 18, 2014)

you got it cda.........

I probably have a handle on it because I probably heard the arguments at the hearings, and have blocked it from my memory.


----------



## cda (Dec 18, 2014)

north star said:
			
		

> *+ & + & +*Spray from what if no sprinklers are required ?
> 
> *+ & + & +*


1, or where walls, partitions or other obstructions are installed that restrict the application of water from hose streams, the basement shall be equipped throughout with an approved automatic sprinkler system.


----------



## fatboy (Dec 18, 2014)

mt, I think at that point you could make the argument that the scenario you describe would not block the hose stream, as they would have access to the entire basement, sans the mechanical room


----------



## cda (Dec 18, 2014)

Need to find to change proposal to the 2012

And

Can anyone post the 2012 commentary ???


----------



## north star (Dec 18, 2014)

*~ & ~ & ~*



cda,

For my own clarification, ...are you saying that anything greater

than the 30 ft. dimension would require sprinkling ?.........Thanks !

Also, ...regarding ***mtlogcabin*** scenario, would a lock on that

proposed Mech. Room wall door, trigger the sprinkling ?





*~ & ~ & ~*


----------



## cda (Dec 18, 2014)

north star said:
			
		

> *~ & ~ & ~*
> 
> cda,
> 
> ...


No, just trying to give a scenario

"""Where any portion of a basement is located more than 75 feet ""

Say it is only 30 feet from an opening, but one wall is blocking, you would have to sprinkle

And also there is no " maximum " size of a basement "with an obstruction" before sprinklers are required, per that section


----------



## mtlogcabin (Dec 18, 2014)

> And also there is no " maximum " size of a basement "with an obstruction" before sprinklers are required, per that section


Or minimum size of basement


----------



## JBI (Dec 18, 2014)

Or provide a window in the boiler room?

There was an older Code that did not require a rated enclosure for a residential boiler/furnace room, but if you did enclose it 45 min rating and door assembly would be required.


----------



## cda (Dec 18, 2014)

mtlogcabin said:
			
		

> Or minimum size of basement


Yep that is what I meant to say


----------



## FM William Burns (Dec 18, 2014)

MT,

Not if the distance does not exceed 75' or if the wall, partition etc. does not obstruct the hose stream.  The scenario you provide will still allow TD <75' with the ability to advance a hose and enact a stream if reading your example correctly and ability to bail out with the opening in accordance with the applicable code section referenced.


----------



## mtlogcabin (Dec 18, 2014)

The wall would be blocking the hose stream in the seperate "HVAC room"

So in NEW construction sprinklers would be required even though the distance is less than 75 ft is the way I am reading it.


----------



## Francis Vineyard (Dec 19, 2014)

I highly recommend to architects and code officials to obtain a copy of Significant Changes (SCIBC) to the IBC 20XX Edition.  They provide additional insight and illustrations not in the commentaries.

Last paragraph from the 2012 SCIBC ;

“One concern during interior fire fighting operations is obstruction of fire streams.  Obstructions such as walls or partitions may prevent the application of water onto the area of fire involvement.  The installation of an automatic sprinkler system in basements over 1500 sf in floor area is now required when obstructions such as walls, partitions or similar elements are introduced which could obstruct the application of hose streams. It should be noted that whether the wall contains door openings or not has no effect on the application of the provision. While some code locations of Class II standpipe (Section 905.5) allow measuring along an available route through the building and through doors, the presence of doorways has no bearing on the code’s application.  Because a wall of and size has the potential to “restrict the application of water,” the building official should  be consulted if the design indicates anything other than a wide-open, unfurnished space and sprinklers are not intended to be installed.”



An interesting training interpretation; https://ibcode.com/uploads/Fire_Code_Question_-_January_25__2012.pdf


----------



## cda (Dec 19, 2014)

OK, so the obstruction rule only applies to basements over 1500 sq ft;

[F] 903.2.11 Specific building areas and hazards.

In all occupancies other than Group U, an automatic sprinkler system shall be installed for building design or hazards in the locations set forth in Sections 903.2.11.1 through 903.2.11.6.

[F] 903.2.11.1 Stories without openings.

An automatic sprinkler system shall be installed throughout all stories, including basements, of all buildings where the floor area exceeds 1,500 square feet (139.4 m2) and where there is not provided at least one of the following types of exterior wall openings:

1. Openings below grade that lead directly to ground level by an exterior stairway complying with Section 1009 or an outside ramp complying with Section 1010. Openings shall be located in each 50 linear feet (15 240 mm), or fraction thereof, of exterior wall in the story on at least one side. The required openings shall be distributed such that the lineal distance between adjacent openings does not exceed 50 feet (15 240 mm).

2. Openings entirely above the adjoining ground level totaling at least 20 square feet (1.86 m2) in each 50 linear feet (15 240 mm), or fraction thereof, of exterior wall in the story on at least one side. The required openings shall be distributed such that the lineal distance between adjacent openings does not exceed 50 feet (15 240 mm). The height of the bottom of the clear opening shall not exceed 44 inches (1118 mm) measured from the floor.

[F] 903.2.11.1.1 Opening dimensions and access.

Openings shall have a minimum dimension of not less than 30 inches (762 mm). Such openings shall be accessible to the fire department from the exterior and shall not be obstructed in a manner that fire fighting or rescue cannot be accomplished from the exterior.

[F] 903.2.11.1.2 Openings on one side only.

Where openings in a story are provided on only one side and the opposite wall of such story is more than 75 feet (22 860 mm) from such openings, the story shall be equipped throughout with an approved automatic sprinkler system, or openings as specified above shall be provided on at least two sides of the story.

[F] 903.2.11.1.3 Basements.

Where any portion of a basement is located more than 75 feet (22 860 mm) from openings required by Section 903.2.11.1, or where walls, partitions or other obstructions are installed that restrict the application of water from hose streams, the basement shall be equipped throughout with an approved automatic sprinkler system.


----------



## FM William Burns (Dec 19, 2014)

MT,

I was envisioning exactly what Francis posted up. The seclusion of the wall, partition etc. in a basement will not present a hose stream obstruction as long as the 75’stretch or travel distance is not exceeded.  A enclosed room would also be permitted in a basement provided we don’t have to stretch a hose line beyond 75’ and follow the hose line back to the opening when (it hits the fan).  This is how I would interpret it from an old hose stretcher's perspective.

FV,

Thanks for the additional information!


----------



## cda (Dec 19, 2014)

glad we do not have basements


----------



## mtlogcabin (Dec 20, 2014)

> Where any portion of a basement is located more than 75 feet (22 860 mm) from openings required by Section 903.2.11.1, or where walls, partitions or other obstructions are installed that restrict the application of water from hose streams, the basement shall be equipped throughout with an approved automatic sprinkler system.


I did read the significant changes and that and the word "or" instead of "and" indicates to me the 75 ft is a moot point if a basement is divided up with walls and no additional openings from the exteior are provided within those divided spaces.


----------



## sergoodo (Jun 28, 2016)

Came across this looking for like minds, which is always a chore...I just want to post a thank you to Francis Vineyard & FM William Burns for instilling sanity to this discussion.  Nothing like a code change enabling limitless subjective interpretation.

Here is my contribution to the insanity:
_
break, break, break it down_
Where any portion of a basement is located more than 75 feet 
from openings required by Section 903.2.11.1, 
*or *
where walls, partitions or other obstructions are installed that restrict the application of water from hose streams, 
the basement shall be equipped throughout with an approved automatic sprinkler system.
_

broke, broke, broke down, now clarify _
Where any portion of a basement is located more than 75 feet from openings required by Section 903.2.11.1, 
*or*
Where any portion of a basement is located more than 75 feet where walls, partitions or where other obstructions are installed that restrict the application of water from hose streams, 
the basement shall be equipped throughout with an approved automatic sprinkler system.

*I am way good with just the FV-WB tag team logic*, any opinions whether or not this contributes?  Anyone with a strong background in English who can deliver a technical beatdown?


----------



## FM William Burns (Jul 7, 2016)

Thanks!  I have always tried to use the approach in regulatory function and in code development.  MT, I would also recommend in the close type situations, have a building owner install a single or dual high temperature sprinkler heads (depending on size of room and head coverage) off the domestic water serving the water heater in the mechanical room.  The domestic supply will always be <10 heads allowing for domestic system.......just a win-win.


----------



## ADAguy (Jul 8, 2016)

Could you compartmentalize the mechanical at one end in a rated area to forgo the sprinklers or not?

Save a dime now and spend dollars later when fire breaks out in unsprinklered space (risk management).


----------

