# Possible Baltimore Forum for us???



## jpranch (Oct 21, 2009)

I know this is a very long post but please read. I need a list to provide the ICC of possible discussion topics and I need it quick! Please, no cheap shots. I know, I guilty as charged. Lets make this happen! Thanks in advance. JP

Post Script: The only editing that was done contained personal information. JP

From ICC

A copy of your email to President Zubia and Vice President Lynn was forwarded to me, as I am responsible for oversight of the new Communities of Interest.  We appreciate your feedback, and I think I can allay at least one, but certainly not all of your concerns.

The bulletin board archives have not been lost, and we are working on a link to make all the previous bulletin board threads available, as many members have noted that there is a good deal of valuable information in some of the threads, something none of us want to lose.

The decision to move away from the bulletin board was not an arbitrary one, and caused us many concerns.  The fundamental issue was that the our old website was based on very old technology that left us incapable of modernizing and expanding the site’s capacity and capabilities.  Moving to where we need to be in state-of-the-art web technology to support a badly needed and long overdue new website had the effect of eliminating our ability to continue the old bulletin board due to irresolvable incompatibility between the two technologies.  Communities of Interest have become popular in many other associations, and appear to be a good fit with ICC due to the wide diversity of professional backgrounds, issues, and interests of our members in both the public and private sectors.  What you see now is the basic skeletons of each Community—enough to get them up and active on the new site.  The Communities going forward are largely member driven, and we anticipate each Community will develop its own outlook and style based on the needs and interests of those who join and participate.

Thank you for your openness in putting forward your concerns over this transition.  I can only assure you that it is a work in progress and, like most new ventures, will require continuing evolution and work to get it completely right.  Now that you have raised it, the whole issue of anonymity of postings is one I will carry back to those engaged in our new website design.  I don’t know what the answer is at this point, but I understand the concern you raise, and believe this is an area we need to evaluate further.

From JP: Thanks for the reply. I think the ICC has made a mistake here and some sort of split may be in the wind. Darn shame. I will be in Baltimore on the 30th through Nov 6th. I would love to discuss this along with other topics that I believe could cause major problems for the ICC. Thanks again for the response.

From ICC:  I appreciate the professionalism of your reply (trust me, not everyone is being so kind).  With this new website, we are still feeling our way, and I am sure we will stick our foot in it more than once before we get it completely right.  As a membership organization, but one whose mission is public safety, some of the decisions regarding enhancing the value of membership vs. trying to be everything to everybody do keep us up at night.  Both sides make some good points, and there are individual parties on both sides that exhibit some very self-serving behavior as well.  I trust this will all work out as cooler heads prevail and the ultimate right decision becomes clearer.

From JP: Thanks. I'm afraid I'm not quite the professional I should be. I was the one who posted "I'd like to kick old Aldof in the nads"! LOL. I have my moments like everybody. Please tell Mr. Zubia if you see him no offence intended. I hope to relay that sediment in person in Baltimore.  I would like to propose something for Baltimore. An open and frank discussion with those of us who have issues to discuss? I'm not talking about a "bitch session". It absolutely must have a skilled moderator / facilitator to stay on track and focused. There are those that feel disenfranchised / disillusioned from and with the ICC. I would much rather see issues resolved and perceived problems fixed than a split happen and another code officials organization formed. Please believe me that the formation of another organization to compete with the ICC and a substantial split is a very real concern.  What say you? JP

From ICC:  I will see what can be arranged.  The last thing we want is members who feel disenfranchised, although we all, staff included, have at various times shared those feelings as ICC has struggled to evolve from the unique cultures of each of the legacy organizations.  Although ICC has been great to me personally, so was ICBO, and I still miss many aspects of the great ICBO culture.  Many carryovers from BOCA and SBCCI I’m sure feel the same way.  Getting bigger doesn’t always mean getting better—that’s something we all have to work at to make happen.

If you feel comfortable doing so, would you mind giving me a short list of some of your major concerns with ICC as we currently know it?  I promise to keep your name out of it if you so desire.  However, in suggesting that some kind of meeting or forum is needed, I am sure I will be asked why and what the issues are—better possibility of getting something going if I have some kind of answer to give.  There are so many friction points we deal with almost daily that I would hesitate to pick a winner here—large vs. small jurisdiction needs, big states vs. small states in voting power, Federal vs. local focus, fire vs. building on residential sprinkler provisions, quality and direction of our educational programs, access to top leadership, chapter benefits, remote voting, product and service pricing—the list can go on and on.

From JP:   I can certainly appreciate you situation. I would (with your permission) like to post this on the BB we have all moved to so I can get a consensus list of topics. I will delete all names, phone numbers, etc...   Please feel free to release my personal information to any ICC staff. I really think a forum would be a step in a good direction. I even have a title for it: "Put on your big girl panties and Cowboy-Up"! Just kidding. Will this work for you? thanks, JP

From ICC:  Sure—whatever it takes to find what the issues are.  Please don’t promise on the alternative site (and we all  know which one we are talking about) that some type of forum is going to definitely take place at ABM, as that is going to take some work to see if it is possible on short notice.  One way or the other, we will find a way to open dialogue and address the issues.  Since these are member issues with ICC, the Board has to decide how they want to approach this, and as staff I can’t presume to speak for your Board, other than to say I think the individual Board members, each perhaps in their own way, are sincere in their desire to serve the membership and make ICC a strong and long-term viable organization that effectively fulfills its mission.  I do like your title for it, by the way—pretty much says it all.  Maybe expand it a little—“If you’ve got a hitch in your giddy-up, put on your big girl panties and Cowboy-up”.


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## RJJ (Oct 21, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???

well for me, I put to all the new members of this site. Think through the issues and let's narrow the list.

JP: As I expressed on the phone it would be great to have a site down talk. I believe that is most important. I will arrange my schedule to be present at any time.

1. We need to stay focus on the issues with the new site. No cheap shots!

2. Basic issues that exist with ICC in general.


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## FM William Burns (Oct 21, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???

*JP:*

An organization “who’s mission is public safety” should promote inclusions in fire safety in their IRC not historic reductions that the general public has no knowledge of but assumes since built to code is safe.  I will PM you my topic and substantiation to add if you agree and please feel free to use my real name too.

It's in your PM Inbox in the User Control Panel (Top Right of Screen)


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## permitguy (Oct 21, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???



			
				jpranch said:
			
		

> The decision to move away from the bulletin board was not an arbitrary one, and caused us many concerns.  The fundamental issue was that the our old website was based on very old technology that left us incapable of modernizing and expanding the site’s capacity and capabilities.  Moving to where we need to be in state-of-the-art web technology to support a badly needed and long overdue new website had the effect of eliminating our ability to continue the old bulletin board due to irresolvable incompatibility between the two technologies.


Their excuse is based on a false choice.  If they are going to continue to spew crap like this, you can't expect them to be genuinely concerned about your point of view.  Bulletin boards are present all over the internet.  They could have easily put a bulletin board on their new website - regardless of the technology - that continued to allow all to join and participate with anonymity regardless of membership.  If they were concerned about the negativity they were seeing, they could have proactively moderated it instead of having a webmaster that only got involved when someone reported a problem.

I wouldn't waste your time with them on this.


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## Rider Rick (Oct 21, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???

jpranch,

Are we american men and women or mice? :shock:

Isn't there an old saying that goes once bitten shame on them twice bitten shame on you?

I will NOT go back to any ICC code bulletin board ever period.

PS. I don't know why this BB can't be ran like NPR or Public TV?

Thank you,

Rick Taylor


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## RJJ (Oct 22, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???

Hopefully, during the day more will respond to JP's request. I am surprised that more haven't posted on this topic knowing that the group here is seldom quiet or caught short on words.

Permitguy: I agree with your post. Had the same thoughts!

Rick: I here ya!

First, I believe this group and the future management of this site needs to be "Transparent" all the time. All aspects of the function and direction need to be in front of all members.

Jp has ask for a list, so lets start with the complaints. A path of communications has been provided and we should use this opportunity to at least talk.

I would lead off with this:

ICC:

1.The features on this new site are far superior,faster and easier to use then the one you have created.

2.The new ICC web site has no PM or email options.

3. No smilies This is big for me. :mrgreen: Oh guess what ICC We have Mr. Green! :lol:

4. No Screen names!

5. The site is slower then the old site and login is a total hassle.

6. Non members are excluded.

7. The public is excluded. This is a real PR issue. The questions from the public and home owners regarding the code are most important. They allow code officials to respond to real time issues and at the same time educate the general public on life safety, code compliant issues and what we do to serve the public.


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## jpranch (Oct 22, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???

This possible forum is not just limited to the restoration of the old BB. I think that the elimination of the BB is just one symptom of a very ill patient. The issue of transparency that rjj talked about is critical. I have issues with the whole certification program. Also concerns about the close association with the federal government and mandated codes to the states.

Please help me with this one. I need to get this list out by tomorrow. Thanks, JP


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## Kearney.200 (Oct 22, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???

If there is such new Tech. on the new ICC site why can't we have remote voting I am in a small AHJ and will rarely if ever have the chance to go and vote in person, I do try and watch the hearing on the web a chance to vote would be nice.


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## permitguy (Oct 22, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???



> This possible forum is not just limited to the restoration of the old BB.


The other issues are all over the board (no pun intended).  I have yet to see anyone lodge their complaints based on anything but individual perceptions, which vary greatly.  If you can't quantify your concerns, they won't be taken seriously.  I will make a prediction that if this meeting happens, it will involve lots of talking and no results.

If you wish, I'll save you some time.  List your concerns and I'll tell you what you're going to hear from ICC.


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## TJacobs (Oct 22, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???



			
				jpranch said:
			
		

> This possible forum is not just limited to the restoration of the old BB. I think that the elimination of the BB is just one symptom of a very ill patient. The issue of transparency that rjj talked about is critical. I have issues with the whole certification program. Also concerns about the close association with the federal government and mandated codes to the states. Please help me with this one. I need to get this list out by tomorrow. Thanks, JP


This is it exactly.  It not just about the BB.  I'll give you items for your list:

1.  Cozying up to NAHB

2.  Cozying up to realtors

3.  Too much emphasis on corporate partnerships

4.  Voting only at meetings most code officials can't attend

5.  Why are we creating a new pool code document?

6.  Why are we creating a competitor to NFPA 13D?

More to come...


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## jpranch (Oct 22, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???

Just received this from the ICC:

Yes, I did check out your post.  On the possibility of a forum, I spoke to Rick Weiland last evening about all of this, and I have some good news and some bad news.  First the bad news—at this late date, the ABM schedule is set and is already overly compacted, particularly in terms of Board member schedules.  All is not lost, however.  If you check the website, one of the events scheduled is a Fireside Chat, where Adolf and Rick will be present to field questions and comments from folks attending the chat—either in person at the ABM or by phone.  Not perhaps the perfect solution, but one that is available for engaging in dialogue on matters of importance to our members and supporters.  Without yet seeing the list, but being aware of some of the issues for which there has been some level of back-and-forth going on for some time, the issues themselves probably could not be individually worked and solved at any one forum or meeting anyway.  The most important thing, in my mind, is to get the important issues on the table, at least for starters.

I don’t know if you were at the Spring hearings in New Orleans, but something similar to this took place in Region 9—issues were aired and Adolf invited those concerned parties in attendance to put together a list of issues and concerns and submit it to the Board.  Not being on the Board, I don’t know the current status of that—whether folks are still working on their list, or whether they have submitted it yet.  The Fireside Chat at our upcoming ABM would appear to represent another opportunity for individuals who were not able to attend the New Orleans meeting to bring forward comments and concerns.  Since you are already working on a short list of the biggest concerns, you may already be ahead of where things ended in New Orleans.

Everyone can make up their own mind whether it appears that the lack of ability to schedule an “eleventh hour” request for a forum of this nature means we are trying to duck the issues, but I can assure you that is not the intent.  Putting together the logistics and schedule of events and meetings of the ABM is a monumental task that takes many months of intense work, including hotel and vendor negotiations, attempts to avoid or schedule around conflicting or overlapping events, and on and on, in an effort to accommodate the many individuals’ and groups’ requests for time.  Personally, I would rather have a couple of root canals without anesthetic than be in charge of planning and running an ABM.

Check out the Fire Side Chat announcement on the website, and see if that will work as a starting point, “getting one’s foot in the door” so to speak, on the issues.  Every productive process and dialogue has to have a starting point, and this already scheduled “event” represents what is possible within the context of the ABM itself.  As advertised, the Presidential Fireside Chats “provide an opportunity for Code Council members and stakeholders to speak directly to the Board President and CEO to exchange ideas, express feedback, and share opinions . . .”   There you go.

Post Script: Thanks to the gent at the icc for giving permission to copy his emails to this board. JP


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## FM William Burns (Oct 22, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???

*JP:*

I hope you got my other PM.  If not, I'll email it to your other address.


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## jpranch (Oct 22, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???

FM, I did receive it. Again, sorry about the delete. I'm still planning on taking our grievences to Baltimore. I talked to some of my code offiicial friends today in Cheyenne and in Maryland. They are soildly convinced that the ICC is headed in the wrong direction.  Pro or against residential sprinklers it dosen't seem to matter. I think (without turning this thread) that Baltimore is going to be a repeat of Minneapolis. There can be no doubt now that the ICC is and has been in real trouble for quite awhile.

If anybody wants to say i told you so, go ahead. But I'm still going to try.

Received an email from WABO today. I have not had a chance to read it yet but it seems that it may have been timed for release just prior to the Baltimore hearings.

Like others here I do have a job and obligations that absolutly take a priority and 12 to 14 hour days take a toll. Ok, thats my whine for the day.

Post Script: Anybody think about why there are 12 posts and 129 visits to this post???

I will do the best that I can.

Darn tired. Time for bed now. Almost.


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## RickAstoria (Oct 23, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???



			
				jpranch said:
			
		

> I know this is a very long post but please read. I need a list to provide the ICC of possible discussion topics and I need it quick! Please, no cheap shots. I know, I guilty as charged. Lets make this happen! Thanks in advance. JPPost Script: The only editing that was done contained personal information. JP
> 
> From ICC
> 
> ...


Mostly directed to President Zubia and the ICC Board of Directors (whatever they are called)

My concern is relatively specific.

Required membership to participate in the Community discussion.

Now more importantly is how the bulletin board was used.  It was used as a resource for answering code related issues and helping general public. What brought about alot of the thread topics was general public (homeowners, owners) who are remodeling their homes, building decks/porches asking questions about code in regards to their project.

These folks who had once joined the bulletin board forum free of charge to ask code related question. They now have to pay to be on the forum so now they are not going to be asking these questions which we helped to answer.

We were serving them by giving them guidance and some direction. What about the cases of individuals who are having issues with their local B.O. or inspector and need some direction and guidance to resolve those issues. It is these nit and grit stuff that is part of the life blood of the free communication and sharing of knowledge and wisdom.

They are now, not going to have that resource and which helped to put these people on the right path which without that will have been more disasterous. When we consider the purpose of safeguarding health, safety and welfare. Open and free sharing of knowledge and wisdom and helping to put these folks on the right is the most significant impact we can do in safeguarding the health, safety and welfare. Not the code itself.

Now, they'll go about things blindly which does not help to safeguard health, safety and welfare.

This is my main concern.

Rick Balkins, Building Designer

rickbalkins(AT)gmail.com   (Replace (AT) with @ symbol).

Astoria, Oregon 97103

------------------------------------------------------------

jpranch & rjj and all, you may share my name and provided information with them.


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## jpranch (Oct 23, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???

Thanks Rick, Very well worded. We all share this very same thought. JP


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## Uncle Bob (Oct 23, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???

I know that regardless of the outcome on all actions in Baltimore; that this forum will "Explode" with controversy.  Please keep in mind that we are "Family" here; with a mutual goal of keeping communcations open.

Maybe, we could do like other "two faced" organizations; and start our debates with;  "With all do respect to my esteemed collegue and Idiot".     

Uncle Bob


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## RJJ (Oct 23, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???

UB: I agree on family  and the group who has moved from ICC BB to this one has deep ties.

I believe within the heart of this group we have killed the horse of Minesotoa and the sprinkler issue for now. Most of us have expressed our positions and argued those points. I find it hard to believe that Baltimore could ever match the twinn cities mess. I don't think the orgization could sink any lower, But next week will tell.

Change is needed! Change will come. This to me is the area of focus. The old BB was closed with out real and proper notification of what was to happen. By the seat of our pants we landed here! We still have new ones signing on each day. So we must be doing something right! We have many issue for this site to resolve and continue to make it better.

I feel that some of our attention needs to be directed towards ICC. The direction the orginazation is going, the finical conditions and how money is being shifted around. These are questions.The economey has hurt everybody including ICC. We have seen and heard of the cut backs. We must remember that as members the ICC is ours or at least we each have a stake in it. I don't believe that a better orginazation in concept could be created. It certianly can be improved, so what must happen is to learn how to work within the system and make change.


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## jpranch (Oct 23, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???

Here is the list so far:

List of concerns for discussion:

“Communities of Interest”

1)	The technology of the new web site BB? Very slow. The old site was superior.

2)	Lack of a private email options.

3)	Lack of anonymity. We do not want our personal information listed.

4)	Non members are excluded! Non members are excluded! Non members are excluded! Now more importantly is how the bulletin board was used. It was used as a resource for answering code related issues and helping general public. What brought about a lot of the thread topics was the general public (homeowners, owners) who are remodeling their homes, building decks/porches asking questions about code in regards to their project.

These folks who had once joined the bulletin board forum free of charge to ask code related question. They now have to pay to be on the forum so now they are not going to be asking these questions which we helped to answer.

We were serving them by giving them guidance and some direction. What about the cases of individuals who are having issues with their local B.O. or inspector and need some direction and guidance to resolve those issues. It is these nit and grit stuff that is part of the life blood of the free communication and sharing of knowledge and wisdom.

They are now, not going to have that resource and which helped to put these people on the right path which without that will have been more disastrous. When we consider the purpose of safeguarding health, safety and welfare. Open and free sharing of knowledge and wisdom and helping to put these folks on the right is the most significant impact we can do in safeguarding the health, safety and welfare. Not the code itself.

Now, they'll go about things blindly which does not help to safeguard health, safety and welfare.

Voting:

1)	If there is such new Tech. on the new ICC site why can't we have remote voting?  I am in a small AHJ and will rarely if ever have the chance to go and vote in person, I do try and watch the hearings on the web. The option to vote securely from a remote location must be an option. If I can charge to my credit card securely from a remote location then casting a vote the same way is surly possible.

Special Interest Groups:

1)	NAHB

2)	NFSC

3)	Realtors

4)	Corporate partnerships

Fire Fighter Safety:

1)	Their appearance of serving a specific special interest in association to the IRC; there appears to be no administrative oversight beyond the development committees and the majority is maintained by one interest.

The fire service has a valid complaint in the IRC development due to the historic reduction in fire safety measures within the residential dwelling caused by this practice. Historic reductions in the guise of affordability such as: increased heights from grade in egress openings, number of required exits, fire resistive separations from hazardous to habitable areas and the increased acceptance of non protected light weight structural assemblies lead the list. An organization “who’s mission is public safety” should promote inclusions for fire safety in their IRC not reductions that the general public has no knowledge of but assumes if built to code is safe.

Code Hearings:

For the most part, besides the BB issues which have we have all heard, I am

most concerned about how they grouped the various committees into a Group A

and a Group B for future code development hearings.  I am now retired and

have a small consulting company.  But when I was a code official I would

still have to attend most of the committee hearings since there is so much

interaction in the codes and the fire service has to deal with more than is

in the fire code.

Finical Condition

Provide the entire membership with the finical condition of the ICC, their foundations, large transactions and details as requested. If there is nothing to hide this should not be an issue to provide full disclosure.


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## TJacobs (Oct 23, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???



			
				Uncle Bob said:
			
		

> I know that regardless of the outcome on all actions in Baltimore; that this forum will "Explode" with controversy.  Please keep in mind that we are "Family" here; with a mutual goal of keeping communcations open.Maybe, we could do like other "two faced" organizations; and start our debates with;  "With all do respect to my esteemed collegue and Idiot".
> 
> Uncle Bob


Mr. Chairman...I reserve the right to revise and extend my remarks...


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## jpranch (Oct 25, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???

Well, I sent what I could on the short go. I know there are more issues that need attention. I do not think the icc will give us a forum with such short notice but one way or another I'll do my best in Baltimore and beyond. I would have to expect and hope that the icc is visiting this site and perhaps realize that they have made quite a mistake?

I hope to hear fron the icc tomorrow? If we as agroup can gain an audience with officials from the icc I will post it here. It would have little to no effect for me to try to go it alone. JP


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## RJJ (Oct 25, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???

JP: you are not alone!


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## jpranch (Oct 25, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???

rjj, Thank you. And I do know that. As I told many, the icc did not just eliminate a web site. They destroyed a family. But we have almost all been reunited. Thanks to Jeff and those who have made this site possible. I will be in Baltimore late in the afternoon on the 30th. Many of you have my cell number. If you do not just email me. We absolutly must stand together. Thanks, JP


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## Uncle Bob (Oct 26, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???

If you are a member; go to the ICC website; enter the "Chapters and Regions" (in Communities); and see how long the following new post is allowed to remain before being censored (removed);

"ICC Censorship

After many years of providing an open forum for Code Officials, Architects, Engineers, Builders, Contractors and the General Public to Openly Discuss and share information about the I-Codes; the ICC has Shut Down it's Bulletin Board; and replaced it with a "Pay for Entry" group of "Communities" that are extremely hard to navigate, and, all attempts for open discussion are censored and removed, by the ICC.

Uncle Bob


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## TJacobs (Oct 26, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???

Hey UB, you will need a bodyguard before long... :shock:


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## fatboy (Oct 26, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???

Gone already UB!


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## Uncle Bob (Oct 26, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???

That's ok; I post another one; on the same page.   

"ICC Censorship

After many years of providing an open forum for Code Officials, Architects, Engineers, Builders, Contractors and the General Public to Openly Discuss and share information about the I-Codes; the ICC has Shut Down it's Bulletin Board; and replaced it with a "Pay for Entry" group of "Communities"; open only to "paid members"; that are extremely hard to navigate, and, all attempts for open discussion are censored and removed, by the ICC.

The ICC gave a five day notice to close the open Bulletin Board on a Thursday; and closed the board on Saturday night; which meant that "there was really ONLY A ONE DAY notice".  Many believe that this was to disperse the Bulletin Board users; so they would lose contact with each other;  and prevent them from meeting and voiceing their objection to the closing.

Thousands of invlauable posts, sharing code information and answering code questions from Architects, Engineers, Builders, Contractors and the General Public; that were available to visitors of the Bulletin Board; were lost.

The ICC's attempt to censor the members of the bulletin board, by removing it; was irresponsible.  The loss of the thousands of informative posts have been lost; and the ICC has lost a valuable asset.

There action will come at a greater expense that the cost of the Bulletin Board.  They have lost the trust of many knowledgeable and dedicated Building Officials, Inspectors, Architects, Engineers, Contractors, other professionals and professional organizations who shared their time, and knowledge with each other and the public on the Bulletin Board.

Many of the members took immediate action; and formed another Bulletin Board, and contacting many of the ICC BB members.  The new Bulletin Board will take time, private donations, and a lot of work; and although without the lost posts, it will be years before it is as helpfull and productive as the old BB; it will prevail and it will survive.

Will this be the Legacy of the "New ICC"?  To opress free association and sharing of knowledge of the I-codes?

Shame on you!

Uncle Bob"

And I signed it.

Ya'll can disown me later.   The nice thing about being retired is; I don't have to worry about my boss coming in and asking me "What the H*** were you thinking"?

Uncle Bob


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## Uncle Bob (Oct 26, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???

And, another posting on the ICC "Community" under Building.

You can't get into most of the communities; because there is no "enter discussion" button on them.

Uncle Bob


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## conarb (Oct 26, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???

Bobby:

It's still there and I responded to it with suggestions about things like the HTML language for the webmaster.


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## JBI (Oct 26, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???

I just checked the new ICC BB. Pretty sad  :cry: ... I copied their opening page with the 'communities' , active members / active topics:

Accessibility

  10 / 4

Architectural Building Science

  7 / 1

Builders Contractors

  7 / 2

Building

  12 / 6

Chapters & Regions

  5 / 1

Code Administration

  9 / 2

Electrical

  4 / 1

Energy

  6 / 0

Engineering Building Science

  7 / 1

Fire

  9 / 4

Green

  6 / 3

Plumbing, Mechanical & Fuel Gas

  5 / 1

Residential Occupancies

  6 / 3

93 total members? For a site that boasted over 10,000 prior to the 'change'?   

29 active 'discussions'? Seriously?  :roll:

We must be onto something here... MORE members, MORE active topics. If you had any doubts about 'our' future these numbers should remove them.   

But, just out of curiosity, does anyone have any Code questions?


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## mtlogcabin (Oct 26, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???

And 99% of the topics where started by ICC employees who haven't come back to participate in there own posts.

 :idea: I bet if they let little b.o. back on they would have incresed activity on all communities :lol:


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## RJJ (Oct 26, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???

so as the #2 Administrator I suppose you are all not in favor of letting Little BO on this site!


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## mtlogcabin (Oct 26, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???

I think he probably has a wealth of knowledge he could share if he would just stop the info-commercials. I would give him a trial run or his own forum


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## JBI (Oct 26, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???

rjj -

While I certainly can understand the knee-jerk reaction, I don't think anyone should be pre-emptively barred from participation. That opens an unsavory door to the type of elitism that is costing ICC our participation in their new board.

I know that some posts are like traffic accidents - you don't want to look, but can't help yourself. And some posters tend to go overboard with their responses. But you can just choose to not read their posts.

Besides, what if he's actually onto something?


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## mjesse (Oct 26, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???

Was that the Str*p-N*t guy?


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## JBI (Oct 26, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???

mj - That's the one...


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## Uncle Bob (Oct 26, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???

John,

Those numbers you posted conserning their site activity.  They are fake numbers; that ICC posted when they first opened the new site;  go to "Builders and Contractors" community.  They state that they have 7 Active members, 2 new members in the last week;, and 2 Active Discussions.

They have no active discussions and you can't post there.

Uncle Bob


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## FM William Burns (Oct 26, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???

I agree with JD

RE: The desire to join the BB.  Besides the moderators can politely point him/her in the right direction if the infomercials begin


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## jpranch (Oct 27, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???

Here it is in part:

Form the ICC:

As part of ICC’s commitment to continually improvement, we would like to hear your feedback on the new Communities of Interest. To facilitate discussion we have set aside time at our Annual Conference for interested members to tell us what changes and improvements would recommend making to the COI’s. The Communities are built on a SharePoint platform, which has incredible potential for users to define an environment that is productive for the important networking that takes place.

Please join us for an open forum at:

2009 International Code Council Annual Conference and Code Development Hearing Code Development Hearings

Communities of Interest Forum

November 1

Baltimore Convention Center

Room:   309

Time:     9:30

This post does not reflect the views or official position of this jurisdiction. No animals were slaughtered while making this post. We just had lunch. Side effects from the reading of this post include but are not limited to:  coughing, gagging, hearing loss, warts, eye fatigue, shingles, numbness in extremities, loss of appetite, flat tires, leaking rain gutters, divorce, job loss, hurricanes, earth quakes and tornados.


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## jpranch (Oct 27, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???

I have been emailing back & forth with the ICC for the last week & half on this issue. Look ladies & gents, I REALLY want to be at that meeting. But is is just not possible. I grew up in Maryland. Haven't seen my mom and dad in over a year. Haven't seen my brother and sister in 3 years. I have a nephew that I have never seen. Not to mention uncles, aunts, nieces, nephews, in laws, and yes even my mother in law. Actually I really love my mother in law. No jokes please! Well, maybe one or two?

I'am one of those "trouble makers" Uncle Bob mentioned. I really want to be there but my whole family has set up a dinner and more for me and my companions from Wyoming.

Sunday November 1st is the only day I can see them. So, family first. My Dad is 78 years old and in reasonability good health but you never know and I love and respect him more than you will ever know. I'm not passing on seeing him for ANY meeting.

Hope you all understand. I would just ask that if any of you that are able to attend would give me a up-date.

Thanks, JP

Post Script: Paul, Thanks for the post. I tell you this, after what all has happened I don't think that I can trust the icc? Once burned twice shy. And to repeat a preivious post, "if the icc does not pull their heads out of the dark by the spring of 2010 I WILL petition the Wyoming Council of Building Officials to resign all association with the icc". This would mean no chapter in the entire state. I talked to my Code Official today about this. (He has been out the last 2 weeks) He supports this position. Want to take bets? Which will be the first entire state to suceed? Time will tell.


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## RJJ (Oct 28, 2009)

Re: Possible Baltimore Forum for us???

John: Just kidding! on Little BO! One doesn't have to read!


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