# manual fire alarm system required??



## syarn (Apr 13, 2011)

type IIB, assembly A-2 restaurant, 2393 sf space, single story, no sprinklers.

tenant space alteration in a strip shopping center existing shell bldg appears to be 17,115 sf, no existing fire alarm.

tenant space occupancy count of 68 people.  there are duct smoke detectors for the RTUs.

is there a section of the code that would require ceiling smoke detectors, ceiling thermal detector, FA pull station, FA horn, FA strobes???

I think section 907.2.1 of IBC 2009 for group A occupancy less than 300 people discounted the need for a manual fire alarm system.


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## cda (Apr 13, 2011)

If

"I think section 907.2.1 of IBC 2009 for group A occupancy less than 300 people discounted the need for a manual fire alarm system.""

Says no then nope


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## syarn (Apr 13, 2011)

thx

the engineer showed the fire alarm on their drawings; waiting to hear back from them;

was curious if there was other parts of the code that triggered the manual fire alarm system e.g. like the 2000 cfm in return duct for the duct smoke detector.


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## permitguy (Apr 13, 2011)

Alarms?  No.  Sprinklers?  Depends.

Is this a change of use, or simply an alteration to an existing A-2?


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## syarn (Apr 13, 2011)

pardon me.

yes this is a change of use from mercantile to assembly (block buster split into a saladworks restaurant on my project side & a five guys restaurant on the other side of new rated demising wall).....


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## permitguy (Apr 13, 2011)

Is either fire area in excess of 5,000 square feet (903.2.1.2)?


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## syarn (Apr 13, 2011)

no

both spaces split the existing space equally so each separate restaurant is approximately 2400 sf.


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## permitguy (Apr 13, 2011)

Just be cautious - fire area could go beyond either restaurant, especially in a II-B building of only 17,115 square feet.  Your new demising wall may be rated, but are the others?


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## syarn (Apr 13, 2011)

good point.

estimated 4937 sf for two restaurants, 9778 sf for multiple businesses & 2400 sf for one mercantile.

so expected 2 hour wall between assembly and mercantile OR business....

the five guys bumped up the TOTAL sf of all the restaurants after the fact in the shopping center shell to over 5000sf BUT because of the new rated demising wall I assume that the INDIVIDUAL fire area for each restaurant was still under 5000sf even if the existing demising walls are NOT rated....


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## cda (Apr 13, 2011)

No duct detectors alone with no other triggering event

Does not kick in a requirement to install a fire alarm system


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## permitguy (Apr 13, 2011)

Given its size and other occupancies, it may currently be utilizing non-separated uses.  The fire area for each restaurant will continue to the next fire wall, fire barrier, or exterior wall - whichever comes first.  If the other walls aren't rated, there's a better than average possibility that you need to sprinkler the A-2s.


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## steveray (Apr 14, 2011)

Sounds like separate or sprinkler.....unless you are positive about firewalls or fire barriers between tenants(fire areas)...


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## FM William Burns (Apr 14, 2011)

Far too often over looked!


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## steveray (Apr 15, 2011)

FM William Burns said:
			
		

> Far too often over looked!


"But we are just building one wall!" How many times have you heard that?

  Luckily, statute here says all A's require a design professional....and they won't get through plan review without a code analysis of the ENTIRE building..at least for height, area , occupancy, and life safety stuff!


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