# garage egress



## Keystone (Jun 20, 2013)

Existing house with finished basement, new 2 story addition being placed which allows basement level 2 bay garage with a man door between bay doors. Would the man door between the bay door qualify as an emergency egress per IRC 2009 section 310.1 and/or would this be considered under 311.1 (without requiring travel through a garage).


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## globe trekker (Jun 20, 2013)

Keystone,

IMO, the man door between the 2 bay doors does not qualify as a MOE door. It is nice

to have, but it would not be approved or required. The main objective is to have a

compliant MOE from the residence itself, not the Garage!

.


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## Architect1281 (Jun 20, 2013)

travel into or through a Garage is NOT allowed

R311.1 Means of egress. All dwellings shall be provided with a means of egress as provided in this section. The means

of egress shall provide a continuous and unobstructed path of vertical and horizontal egress travel from all portions of the

dwelling to the exterior of the dwelling at the required egress door without requiring travel through a garage.


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## cboboggs (Jun 20, 2013)

IMO, because of the travel through the garage, the man door would not qualify as a MOE.


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## mtlogcabin (Jun 20, 2013)

You have an existing basement and egress is through an existing stairs to the main floor of the house.

Addition is for a garage at the basement level and living space above. Correct? The garage does not have an emergency exit opening nor a man door for exiting which is not required by code.

Unless the addition is compromising an existing emergency rescue opening I do not see an issue as long as the occupants can exit up the existing stairs through the main floor living areas


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## Keystone (Jun 21, 2013)

Clarification, the existing house constructed prior to codes in this area has existing finished basement with sliding door directly to grade. Now the two bay garages with man door will be placed eliminating the sliding door for a rated door into the space from the garages. The question is meant to focus on current code with respect to the egress requirement or change thereof but with that said an existing stair to the first floor living space is present but is not a direct access to the exterior.


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## globe trekker (Jun 21, 2013)

Keystone,

You appear to have 2 separate conditions. One is the finished basement, ..the other is

the Garage. You cannot exit from the Residence through the garage as a compliant MOE.

If you have a compliant stairway from the basement to the upper floor, then the upper

floor will need a minimum of one MOE to exit the Residence.

What is the basement being used for today?  And is the finsihed basement now the

Garage?

.


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## cboboggs (Jun 21, 2013)

Are there any other emergency egress openings in basement or is the sliding door the only one?


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## rogerpa (Jun 21, 2013)

You are eliminating an existing MOE. IMO, you need to provide a new MOE, door or window on that level. You could also add an anteroom to allow exiting to the outside without passing through the garage.

*R102.7.1 Additions, alterations or repairs*. Additions, alterations or repairs to any structure shall conform to the requirements for a new structure without requiring the existing structure to comply with all of the requirements of this code, unless otherwise stated. *Additions, alterations or repairs shall not cause an existing structure to become unsafe or adversely affect the performance of the building.*



*AJ102.1 General.* Regardless of the category of work being performed, the work shall not cause the structure to become unsafe or adversely affect the performance of the building; shall not cause an existing mechanical or plumbing system to become unsafe, hazardous, insanitary or overloaded; and unless expressly permitted by these provisions, *shall not make the building any less conforming to this code or to any previously approved alternative arrangements than it was before the work was undertaken.*


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## rleibowitz (Jun 21, 2013)

In Massachusetts you are allowed to exit through a garage door as long as it meets the requirements of a second MOE (MA requires 2 MOE's per residence)...Its an exception to 2009 IRC R311.1 and is apart of our MA. amendments. The 2009 IRC requires a MOE from a basement, we would not allow that egress to be abandoned for the construction of a garage.


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## jar546 (Jun 21, 2013)

Keystone said:
			
		

> Existing house with finished basement, new 2 story addition being placed which allows basement level 2 bay garage with a man door between bay doors. Would the man door between the bay door qualify as an emergency egress per IRC 2009 section 310.1 and/or would this be considered under 311.1 (without requiring travel through a garage).


If that is the only means of egress out of the basement, then NO, it cannot be used as the MOE for the basement.  I had a very similar situation in PA last year and they ended up putting in a bilco door in the existing basement.


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## Keystone (Jun 21, 2013)

Globe trekker – today the basement is finished with a sliding door directly to exterior grade and an existing stair to 1st floor (primary level). The basement is used as a rec room.

The two bay garages containing a center man door with 1 story above (primary level) will be added to extend the house in its entirety.

Cboboggs – besides the sliding door which will have to be replaced with a fire rated door due to entry directly into the garage, no direct egress besides the man door between the garage bay doors.

Rogerpa – thanks for AJ102.1

Jar546 – The paths of travel would be – stairs to the primary level of the residence, not a direct egress and through the fire rated door into the garage.

The lack of egress has been denied two days ago, the contractor has relevant contacts in the industry and they are of the opinion the official – me – is misinterpreting. The contractor plans on appealing ($750.00 to appeal) but I am want all my eye’s (i) dotted (.) and tees (t) crossed, second and third opinions are valuable.


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## globe trekker (Jun 21, 2013)

Keystone,

With the discussion offered so far, do you have the information needed to counter the contractor's

claims?   Does the 2009 IRC allow a sliding door vs.  a side hinged type of door as a compliant

MOE from your basement?

.


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## rleibowitz (Jun 21, 2013)

Sorry, In Massachusetts you are allowed to exit through a garage if it has a man door!


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## jar546 (Jun 21, 2013)

rleibowitz said:
			
		

> Sorry, In Massachusetts you are allowed to exit through a garage if it has a man door!


Yep, but the house is not in MA


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## peach (Jun 22, 2013)

If the house was built in the "olden days" (ie before basement egress was required by code), it would be allowed to remain that way (not a good idea, but a legal use).  The sliding door, actually, doesn't meet the requirements for a side hinged door, anyway.

However, by altering the basement, a legally complying means of egress is required.. and NOT thru a garage R311, as previously cited.


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## Francis Vineyard (Jun 22, 2013)

Assuming there is a front door as the MOE and the basements required EERO is the sliding door; with these types of garage additions here a new door opening or EERO window is installed in the adjacent corner of the basement near the same grade plane.

As a reminder fire doors and fire-resistance separation are not prescribed between the garage and residence.

Francis


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## rogerpa (Jun 22, 2013)

FV responded while I was typing.

Since this is a (walkout) basement, I think it's safe to assume that there is another door (above) that qualifies as the "egress door" and therefore the side-hinged requirement does not apply.

What is required is an EERO (R310.1) that opens "directly into a public way, or to a yard or court that opens to a public way." While this may not have been required when the home was originally constructed and "legal occupancies" may be permitted continue without upgrading, the alteration cannot create a less safe condition and since the sliding door currently provides an EERO from the space, an EERO must be maintained, IMO.


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