# Residential smoke detectors in a commercial building



## retire09 (Oct 23, 2013)

Is there any problem with installing standard residential type smoke detectors in a commercial building that does not require a fire alarm system?

If no system is required but residential devices could offer some level of protection, is there any code that would disallow this?


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## cda (Oct 23, 2013)

Well yes no

See it all the time

Mainly someone sticks one up for whatever reason/ not required

I do not say anything normally, now if I see a lot of them in a business would say something

Problem is someone has to be near to hear it


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## retire09 (Oct 23, 2013)

Why would you say something if you see a lot of them if they are not required?

Are they not allowed by code?

I know they are not allowed as a required alarm system but why would they not be allowed or even discouraged in buildings not requiring a system?

Are they not better than nothing?


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## cda (Oct 23, 2013)

Not in the middle of the night or weekends when no one was there

If I saw a lot I would ask why they were there

Did the business think they were needed

What were they trying to achieve

Would explain they are not required and not any good if no one is there


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## mark handler (Oct 23, 2013)

Pro

Could save a life

Con

False sense of security

Probably not per manufactures warranty


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## RJJ (Oct 23, 2013)

I agree with false sense of security.


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## Builder Bob (Oct 23, 2013)

something is better than nothing.......


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## RJJ (Oct 23, 2013)

Depends on the something!


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## rnapier (Oct 23, 2013)

It would be a violation. The ones I am familiar with are limited to dwelling use only. I have cited this in the past.

NEC

110.3 Examination, Identification, Installation, and Use

of Equipment.

(B) Installation and Use. Listed or labeled equipment

shall be installed and used in accordance with any instructions

included in the listing or labeling.


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## fatboy (Oct 23, 2013)

I certainly would not prohibit them, as BB said, better han nothing.


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## mtlogcabin (Oct 23, 2013)

> Problem is someone has to be near to hear it


That is not a problem that is the purpose of a smoke alarm

You are wanting them perform like a smoke detector.

If a detection system is not required and someone installs an alarm it is an improvement.


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## rth (Oct 23, 2013)

When I see these I explain that they are not required for this particular occupancy and give the them the speech about the intended use of residential smoke alarms and how important it is to have them where you sleep. I also make sure they understand this is only for the occupants inside the building and will not alert the FD if there is a fire at any time. Then I bump the test button and check the date on the back of them and explain that if they do have them they must be functional and less than 10 years old.

Then I thank them for their efforts to increase the life safety for the occupants of their business. Then I give the speech about CO alarms. That usually lasts long enough to find an exit completely occluded and the conversation changes significantly.


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## rnapier (Oct 23, 2013)

Trouble is down the road I have seen them accepted by the fire marshal where state code changes require detectors and they don't realize these do not qualify.


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## mtlogcabin (Oct 24, 2013)

rnapier said:
			
		

> Trouble is down the road I have seen them accepted by the fire marshal where state code changes require detectors and they don't realize these do not qualify.


Then he should not be a Fire Marshal


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## mark handler (Oct 24, 2013)

Residential Smoke Detectors in Commercial Buildings


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## retire09 (Oct 24, 2013)

I would say that this is the same as cooking appliances intended for residential use and those intended for commercial use.

Commercial ranges are specifically disallowed in residential uses but residential is not disallowed in commercial.

The UL standards identify the intended use of the items but if not specifically disallowed by code in other uses I would say they are allowed.

Maybe the manufacturers warranty would not apply but who cares.

If I want to keep a battery operated CO detector in my tent while camping why would anyone in the life safety business try to stop me because the device is not UL listed for tents? Some things you do just because it makes sense.


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