# Emergency egress windows for Classrooms



## Examiner (Aug 19, 2013)

The IBC has removed the requirement in classrooms for several editions now but NFPA up to the 2009 edition still has it.  Does anyone have a newer NFPA that may have now deleted this outdated requirement.  It is in 14.2.11 in the 2009 NFPA 101 edition.  Also NFPA also requires a second means of egress for interior Classrooms.

Our state Fire Marshall does not use NFPA but the State Guidelines for schools mentions Life Safety Code regarding windows for emergency egress.  It mentions the requirement but no edition or chapter and verse.  Our state does not have a building code it is up to the local jurisdictions for a building code.


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## cda (Aug 19, 2013)

Our state Fire Marshall does not use NFPA but the State Guidelines for schools mentions Life Safety Code regarding windows for emergency egress. It mentions the requirement but no edition or chapter and verse. Our state does not have a building code it is up to the local jurisdictions for a building code.

So does the state require you to comply with 101 and if yes have they adopted  a specific edition?


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## jpranch (Aug 19, 2013)

Examiner said:
			
		

> The IBC has removed the requirement in classrooms for several editions now but NFPA up to the 2009 edition still has it.  Does anyone have a newer NFPA that may have now deleted this outdated requirement.  It is in 14.2.11 in the 2009 NFPA 101 edition.  Also NFPA also requires a second means of egress for interior Classrooms.Our state Fire Marshall does not use NFPA but the State Guidelines for schools mentions Life Safety Code regarding windows for emergency egress.  It mentions the requirement but no edition or chapter and verse.  Our state does not have a building code it is up to the local jurisdictions for a building code.


2012 LSC 14.2.11.1.1 still requires egress windows. 14.2.11.1.2 contains 3 exception: 1) The building is fully sprinklered in accordance with section 9.7.  2) Where the room or space has a door leading directly to an exit or directly to the outside of the building. 3) Reserved. 4) Rooms located 4 or more stories above the finished ground level. Hope this helps.


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## jpranch (Aug 19, 2013)

Here is the actual code:

View attachment 809


View attachment 809


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## Examiner (Aug 20, 2013)

Jpranch: thanks for the information.  It has not changed much at all.

cda; the State Board of Ed retained a professor at the one of the colleges to do the guidelines study.  Not an actual practicing Architect who has extensive knowledge of codes.  All the study did was mention the Life Safety Code without any reference to an edition or number of said LSC.  However, the State Board of Ed requires the windows except if there is a fire suppression system.  They did modify their old standards if you have a fire suppression system.


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## brudgers (Aug 22, 2013)

"Outdated" is probably not the best description. The process by which the IBC is modified differs from that by which the NFPA is altered. The NFPA tends to create code provisions based on actual experience in the field - that experience often involving the removal of corpses in the wake of a life-safety shortcoming.   On the other hand, the ICC changes its codes based on theories, including theories advanced by trade constituencies. They sell their codes based on cost savings achieved from consistency. They don't sell their codes based upon claims of more thorough research.


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## jar546 (Aug 22, 2013)

brudgers said:
			
		

> "Outdated" is probably not the best description. The process by which the IBC is modified differs from that by which the NFPA is altered. The NFPA tends to create code provisions based on actual experience in the field - that experience often involving the removal of corpses in the wake of a life-safety shortcoming.   On the other hand, the ICC changes its codes based on theories, including theories advanced by trade constituencies. They sell their codes based on cost savings achieved from consistency. They don't sell their codes based upon claims of more thorough research.


He's alive!  Brudgers is alive.  Now Mr. Softy will never come back for sure.

The ICC can learn some things about code changes and adoption from the NFPA.


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## RJJ (Aug 22, 2013)

Now how will that work for security in schools? We see more & more lockdowns!


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