# just another Thanksgiving?



## RJJ (Nov 26, 2009)

Boy has the US fallen far from the mark!

General Thanksgiving

By the PRESIDENT of the United States Of America

A PROCLAMATION

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WHEREAS it is the duty of all nations to acknowledge the providence of Almighty God, to obey His will, to be grateful for His benefits, and humbly to implore His protection and favour; and Whereas both Houses of Congress have, by their joint committee, requested me "to recommend to the people of the United States a DAY OF PUBLICK THANKSGIVING and PRAYER, to be observed by acknowledging with grateful hearts the many and signal favors of Almighty God, especially by affording them an opportunity peaceably to establish a form of government for their safety and happiness:"

NOW THEREFORE, I do recommend and assign THURSDAY, the TWENTY-SIXTH DAY of NOVEMBER next, to be devoted by the people of these States to the service of that great and glorious Being who is the beneficent author of all the good that was, that is, or that will be; that we may then all unite in rendering unto Him our sincere and humble thanks for His kind care and protection of the people of this country previous to their becoming a nation; for the signal and manifold mercies and the favorable interpositions of His providence in the course and conclusion of the late war; for the great degree of tranquility, union, and plenty which we have since enjoyed;-- for the peaceable and rational manner in which we have been enable to establish Constitutions of government for our safety and happiness, and particularly the national one now lately instituted;-- for the civil and religious liberty with which we are blessed, and the means we have of acquiring and diffusing useful knowledge;-- and, in general, for all the great and various favours which He has been pleased to confer upon us.

And also, that we may then unite in most humbly offering our prayers and supplications to the great Lord and Ruler of Nations and beseech Him to pardon our national and other transgressions;-- to enable us all, whether in publick or private stations, to perform our several and relative duties properly and punctually; to render our National Government a blessing to all the people by constantly being a Government of wise, just, and constitutional laws, discreetly and faithfully executed and obeyed; to protect and guide all sovereigns and nations (especially such as have shewn kindness unto us); and to bless them with good governments, peace, and concord; to promote the knowledge and practice of true religion and virtue, and the increase of science among them and us; and, generally to grant unto all mankind such a degree of temporal prosperity as he alone knows to be best.

GIVEN under my hand, at the city of New-York, the third day of October, in the year of our Lord, one thousand seven hundred and eighty-nine.

(signed) G. Washington

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Source: The Massachusetts Centinel, Wednesday, October 14, 1789

A copy of the original Centinel printing is also available.


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## jar546 (Nov 26, 2009)

Re: just another Thanksgiving?

Wow! Even George Washington went to NYC for the Macy's Thanksgiving Day Parade


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## packsaddle (Nov 26, 2009)

Re: just another Thanksgiving?

Compare President Washington's eloquent proclamation to a recent proclamation by Obama:



> "There's something about August going into September where everybody in Washington gets all wee-weed up"


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## Uncle Bob (Nov 27, 2009)

Re: just another Thanksgiving?

This Nation; under new leadership; has taken a new path.

Those who are watchful of the leadership and direction of this Nation; should read very carefully these Presidential Thanksgiving Day Proclamations:

President George Washington;

Thanksgiving Proclamation

[New York, 3 October 1789]

By the President of the United States of America, a Proclamation.

*Whereas it is the duty of all Nations to acknowledge the providence of Almighty God, to obey his will, to be grateful for his benefits, and humbly to implore his protection and favor-- and whereas both Houses of Congress have by their joint Committee requested me to recommend to the People of the United States a day of public thanksgiving and prayer to be observed by acknowledging with grateful hearts the many signal favors of Almighty God especially by affording them an opportunity peaceably to establish a form of government for their safety and happiness.*

Now therefore I do recommend and assign Thursday the 26th day of November next to be devoted by the People of these States to the service of that great and glorious Being, who is the beneficent Author of all the good that was, that is, or that will be-- That we may then all unite in rendering unto him our sincere and humble thanks--for his kind care and protection of the People of this Country previous to their becoming a Nation--for the signal and manifold mercies, and the favorable interpositions of his Providence which we experienced in the course and conclusion of the late war--for the great degree of tranquility, union, and plenty, which we have since enjoyed--for the peaceable and rational manner, in which we have been enabled to establish constitutions of government for our safety and happiness, and particularly the national One now lately instituted--for the civil and religious liberty with which we are blessed; and the means we have of acquiring and diffusing useful knowledge; and in general for all the great and various favors which he hath been pleased to confer upon us.

and also that we may then unite in most humbly offering our prayers and supplications to the great Lord and Ruler of Nations and beseech him to pardon our national and other transgressions-- to enable us all, whether in public or private stations, to perform our several and relative duties properly and punctually--to render our national government a blessing to all the people, by constantly being a Government of wise, just, and constitutional laws, discreetly and faithfully executed and obeyed--to protect and guide all Sovereigns and Nations (especially such as have shewn kindness unto us) and to bless them with good government, peace, and concord--To promote the knowledge and practice of true religion and virtue, and the encrease of science among them and us--and generally to grant unto all Mankind such a degree of temporal prosperity as he alone knows to be best.

Given under my hand at the City of New York the third day of October in the year of our Lord 1789.

Go: Washington

President Abraham Lincoln

By the President of the United States of America.

A Proclamation.

The year that is drawing towards its close, has been filled with the blessings of fruitful fields and healthful skies. To these bounties, which are so constantly enjoyed that we are prone to forget the source from which they come, others have been added, which are of so extraordinary a nature, that they cannot fail to penetrate and soften even the heart which is habitually insensible to the ever watchful providence of Almighty God. In the midst of a civil war of unequaled magnitude and severity, which has sometimes seemed to foreign States to invite and to provoke their aggression, peace has been preserved with all nations, order has been maintained, the laws have been respected and obeyed, and harmony has prevailed everywhere except in the theatre of military conflict; while that theatre has been greatly contracted by the advancing armies and navies of the Union. Needful diversions of wealth and of strength from the fields of peaceful industry to the national defence, have not arrested the plough, the shuttle or the ship; the axe has enlarged the borders of our settlements, and the mines, as well of iron and coal as of the precious metals, have yielded even more abundantly than heretofore. Population has steadily increased, notwithstanding the waste that has been made in the camp, the siege and the battle-field; and the country, rejoicing in the consiousness of augmented strength and vigor, is permitted to expect continuance of years with large increase of freedom. No human counsel hath devised nor hath any mortal hand worked out these great things. They are the gracious gifts of the Most High God, who, while dealing with us in anger for our sins, hath nevertheless remembered mercy. It has seemed to me fit and proper that they should be solemnly, reverently and gratefully acknowledged as with one heart and one voice by the whole American People. *I do therefore invite my fellow citizens in every part of the United States, and also those who are at sea and those who are sojourning in foreign lands, to set apart and observe the last Thursday of November next, as a day of Thanksgiving and Praise to our beneficent Father who dwelleth in the Heavens.* And I recommend to them that while offering up the ascriptions justly due to Him for such singular deliverances and blessings, they do also, with humble penitence for our national perverseness and disobedience, commend to His tender care all those who have become widows, orphans, mourners or sufferers in the lamentable civil strife in which we are unavoidably engaged, and fervently implore the interposition of the Almighty Hand to heal the wounds of the nation and to restore it as soon as may be consistent with the Divine purposes to the full enjoyment of peace, harmony, tranquillity and Union.

In testimony whereof, I have hereunto set my hand and caused the Seal of the United States to be affixed.

Done at the City of Washington, this Third day of October, in the year of our Lord one thousand eight hundred and sixty-three, and of the Independence of the Unites States the Eighty-eighth.

By the President: Abraham Lincoln

President Barack Obama

A PROCLAMATION

What began as a harvest celebration between European settlers and indigenous communities nearly four centuries ago has become our cherished tradition of Thanksgiving. This day's roots are intertwined with those of our Nation, and its history traces the American narrative.

Today, we recall President George Washington, who proclaimed our first national day of public thanksgiving to be observed "by acknowledging with grateful hearts the many and signal favors of Almighty God," and President Abraham Lincoln, who established our annual Thanksgiving Day to help mend a fractured Nation in the midst of civil war. We also recognize the contributions of Native Americans, who helped the early colonists survive their first harsh winter and continue to strengthen our Nation. From our earliest days of independence, and in times of tragedy and triumph, Americans have come together to celebrate Thanksgiving.

As Americans, we hail from every part of the world. While we observe traditions from every culture, Thanksgiving Day is a unique national tradition we all share. Its spirit binds us together as one people, each of us thankful for our common blessings.

As we gather once again among loved ones, let us also reach out to our neighbors and fellow citizens in need of a helping hand. This is a time for us to renew our bonds with one another, and we can fulfill that commitment by serving our communities and our Nation throughout the year. In doing so, we pay tribute to our country's men and women in uniform who set an example of service that inspires us all. Let us be guided by the legacy of those who have fought for the freedoms for which we give thanks, and be worthy heirs to the noble tradition of goodwill shown on this day.

NOW, THEREFORE, I, BARACK OBAMA, President of the United States of America, by virtue of the authority vested in me by the Constitution and the laws of the United States, do hereby proclaim Thursday, November 26, 2009, as a National Day of Thanksgiving. I encourage all the people of the United States to come together, whether in our homes, places of worship, community centers, or any place where family, friends and neighbors may gather, with gratitude for all we have received in the past year; to express appreciation to those whose lives enrich our own; and to share our bounty with others.

IN WITNESS WHEREOF, I have hereunto set my hand this twentieth day of November, in the year of our Lord two thousand nine, and of the Independence of the United States of America the two hundred and thirty-fourth.

BARACK OBAMA

If you don't see the difference; please read them again,

Uncle Bob


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## RJJ (Nov 27, 2009)

Re: just another Thanksgiving?

Pack & UB:  Well UB I had planned to post Lincoln's next. Good fine! It is a blessing to see that all have not fallen asleep accross the country. We are far from the mark that our Fathers before us had placed as a bench mark, not to achieve, but to maintain.

Last night as my family join to offer a few words to be thankful for the blessing bestowed, to remember the family members no longer sitting at the table,those in other places, to be grateful of those who made it home safe and to those in service to our country, I was humbled just from the words of Washington & Lincoln. Hopefully, some day I will earn the coin of "well done my good and faithful servant".

In the back of my mind was a song from years ago "and its 1,2,3, what are we fighting for" with a slight change "Just ask me and I will explain". How years can grow wisdom!


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## kilitact (Nov 27, 2009)

Re: just another Thanksgiving?

I would say that our current president is acknowledging our diverse culture in America

123 brings back memories, heres another

*The eastern world, it is exploding*

*Violence flarin’, bullets loadin’*

*You’re old enough to kill, but not for votin’*

*You don’t believe in war, but what’s that gun you’re totin’*

*And even the Jordan River has bodies floatin’*

strange how history keeps repeating itself.


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## FM William Burns (Nov 27, 2009)

Re: just another Thanksgiving?

Yea, those poor Native American cultures infected, exploited and eradicated in the name of prosperity


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## kilitact (Nov 28, 2009)

Re: just another Thanksgiving?

FM Williams Burns wrote:



> Yea, those poor Native American cultures infected, exploited and eradicated in the name of prosperity


Yea, I agree FM … some say that it was a good thing. Similar to those who proclaim the holocaust never happen.


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## Uncle Bob (Nov 29, 2009)

Re: just another Thanksgiving?

Yes, those horrible Europeans should have turned around and left for good; as soon as they found this country was inhabited by peace loving natives who never had a cross word with their neighbors.

Click link below and see what is left of these poor, disenfranchised people;

http://www.cas.okstate.edu/jb/faculty/k ... native.htm

To help alleviate the poverty; please, don't forget to visit the Casinos; there is one near you, awaiting your generous contributions.

Uncle Bob


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## kilitact (Nov 29, 2009)

Re: just another Thanksgiving?

Uncle Bob wrote;



> To help alleviate the poverty; please, don't forget to visit the Casinos; there is one near you, awaiting your generous contributions.


I agree,   

How many losers does it take to repay this debt?   

*California Genocide*

Genocide is a strong word denoting a planned extermination of a racial, political or cultural group. It should not be used lightly. But what happened to the indigenous tribes of California qualifies as genocide, and that history is explored in A Seat at the Drum.

For thousands of years, the southern and central Pacific coast region was one of the most densely populated areas north of Mexico. Population estimates range as high as 300,000 American Indians speaking 80 distinct languages. Because of the bounty of the sea, the pastures and hills, the Indians didn't have to farm to survive. They fished, hunted and gathered an enormous variety of wild food. Acorns ground up and cooked into a soup, mush or bread was the staple for many groups.

In California, the genocide of Native tribes was done in the name of the church.

At that time, the Chumash tribe was the largest group with around 20,000 members. Despite the diversity of tribes in the region, archeological evidence doesn't indicate a lot of inter-tribal warfare.

Then in 1769, a Franciscan missionary named Father Junipero Serra led a Spanish army up from Mexico and reached present-day San Diego. It was he who built the first of 21 missions that would extend up north to San Francisco. When he encountered the Chumash, Fr. Serra failed to recognize a centuries-old religious tradition. "Believe me," he wrote, "when I saw their general behavior, their pleasing ways and engaging manners, my heart was broken to think that they were still deprived of the light of the Holy Gospel." He promptly set out to convert all the Indians he encountered to Christianity.

He also set out to make the native populations slaves to the farms supporting the missions. Spanish soldiers kidnapped Indians by the thousands. They were given Spanish names, dressed in blue uniforms and became farm workers — something they had never done. They also were forced to care for livestock, tanned hides, and produced candles, bricks, tiles, shoes, saddles, soap and other necessities.

If they misbehaved, they were whipped, branded, mutilated or even executed. Hundreds and thousands of Indians — both in the missions and in surrounding areas — died of malaria, smallpox or other new diseases imported by the Spanish for which there was no native immunity.

Beginning in 1775, many of the mission Indians began to revolt. Some 800 Ipai and Tipai Indians burned down the San Diego mission that year. The revolt was brutally put down by the Spanish soldiers, as were all of the revolts.

The years of warfare and mistreatment took their toll. At the Santa Barbara mission alone, more than 4,600 Chumash names fill the burial registry. Indians were put in mass graves near the church, and were denied either traditional or Christian burials.

After 65 years, the mission period ended in 1834 after Mexico won its independence from Spain and secularized the missions. Only then were the mission Indians free to leave, but by then they had no villages to return to.

In 1848, the United States acquired California from Mexico just in time for the Gold Rush of 1849. Now, the mountain tribes encountered European miners who saw Indian women as concubines and Indian men as slaves or even as shooting targets for sport. The newspapers of the time were filled with headlines about Indians being killed:

"Good Haul of Diggers" [a slang term for Indian slave laborers in the gold fields]

"Thirty-eight Bucks Killed"

"Forty Squaws and Children Taken"

"Indiscriminate Massacre of Indians — Women and Children Butchered"

This last headline told of 188 peaceful Indian men, women and children killed in Humboldt Bay. The story was just a little too sympathetic to the Indians, so the editor was run out of town.

From a high population of 300,000 before contact, Indians in California reached a low of 16,000 in 1900. According to Alvin M. Josephy in his book 500 Nations, the history of the California tribes "was as close to genocide as any tribal people had faced, or would face, on the North American continent."


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## Uncle Bob (Nov 29, 2009)

Re: just another Thanksgiving?

Kilitact,

What do you believe needs to be done?

Uncle Bob


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## kilitact (Nov 29, 2009)

Re: just another Thanksgiving?

Uncle Bob wrote;



> Kilitact,What do you believe needs to be done?
> 
> Uncle Bob


*Learn from the past, not continue to destroy??*

Yeah, come on all of you, big strong men,

Uncle Sam needs your help again.

He's got himself in a terrible jam

Way down yonder in Vietnam

So put down your books and pick up a gun,

We're gonna have a whole lotta fun.

In his January 1851 message to the California legislature, California Governor Peter H. Burnett promised "a war of extermination will continue to be waged between the two races until the Indian race becomes extinct." Newspapers cheered on the campaign. In 1853 the Yreka Herald called on the government to provide aid to "enable the citizens of the north to carry on a war of extermination until the last redskin of these tribes has been killed. Extermination is no longer a question of time--the time has arrived, the work has commenced and let the first man who says treaty or peace be regarded as a traitor." Other newspapers voiced similar sentiments.

Towns offered bounty hunters cash for every Indian head or scalp they obtained. Rewards ranged from $5 for every severed head in Shasta City in 1855 to 25 cents for a scalp in Honey Lake in 1863. One resident of Shasta City wrote about how he remembers seeing men bringing mules to town, each laden with eight to twelve Indian heads. Other regions passed laws that called for collective punishment for the whole village for crimes committed by Indians, up to the destruction of the entire village and all of its inhabitants. These policies led to the destruction of as many as 150 Native communities.

In both 1851 and 1852 California paid out $1 million--revenue from the gold fields--to militias that hunted down and slaughtered Indians. In 1857, the state issued $400,000 in bonds to pay for anti-Indian militias.


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## Uncle Bob (Nov 29, 2009)

Re: just another Thanksgiving?

Kilitact,

"Learn from the past, not continue to destroy??"

The poetry is cute; and the example of wrongs done in the past are understood.

You defintely have evidence of wrong doings and an opinion of the United States government's responsibility for them.

Do you have any idea of what specifically should be done today?

I really am interested in what actions you feel are necessary,

Uncle Bob


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## RJJ (Nov 30, 2009)

Re: just another Thanksgiving?

Kil: If anything is true, History is 20/20 and the wrongs of the past will never be repaid at any price in silver. We must see the mistakes and not allow them to be repeated. However, we seem to want to repeat them anyway.  :roll:


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## kilitact (Nov 30, 2009)

Re: just another Thanksgiving?

Uncle Bob, still hope to get that forty acres and a mule, lol

Recycle





rjj, thats my point,I try to not repeat the mistakes, but the memory fails.


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## Uncle Bob (Nov 30, 2009)

Re: just another Thanksgiving?

Kilitact,

Your right, he is my kind of man.  God has blessed people like Dan Phillips; and, the poor struggling families he has helped.

Uncle Bob


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## rktect 1 (Nov 30, 2009)

Re: just another Thanksgiving?

Wow, I can't wait to see how Christmas gets tossed around on this BB.


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## JBI (Nov 30, 2009)

Re: just another Thanksgiving?

rk - Been working on my best 'BAH! Humbug!' for weeks now...


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## conarb (Nov 30, 2009)

Re: just another Thanksgiving?

Uncle Bob:

Did you inspect this projects?


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## kilitact (Nov 30, 2009)

Re: just another Thanksgiving?

John Drobyshwrote:



> rk - Been working on my best 'BAH! Humbug!' for weeks now...


Darn, you have better humbugs than what you have been posting all this time, your good JD   

Uncle Bob wrote:



> Your right, he is my kind of man. God has blessed people like Dan Phillips; and, the poor struggling families he has helped


Uncle Bob, I would agree, one small step can make a  lotta difference


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## jeffc (Nov 30, 2009)

Re: just another Thanksgiving?

The best and fastest way to ruin and good bb is to turn everyone against one another or to start choosing up sides. Is this a political arena or a building codes forum? Now is the time to decide before this gets out of hand. My vote is to keep the forum to building code issues. Many political forums exist so I don’t understand the need or desire to proselytize on this site.


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## Uncle Bob (Nov 30, 2009)

Re: just another Thanksgiving?

Jeffc,

Welcome to the forum,

We been doing this for several years now.  In addition to being "the place" to get great code information; it's a place where we can relax and rub each other the wrong way once and a while.  We really do like each other.   

Think of us as a family; and it will all make perfect sense.

Uncle Bob


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## packsaddle (Nov 30, 2009)

Re: just another Thanksgiving?

Hence the title "Off-Topic Posts".


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## mtlogcabin (Nov 30, 2009)

Re: just another Thanksgiving?

JeffC

No one on this BB is trying to proselytize anybody for a paticular religion, political party or to a cause. We have lost the art of true communication where opposing views are discussed with civility and thought provoking conversation. I agree with UB this is like a family and sometimes family members unload or confide in each other or just want to know what others think


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## FM William Burns (Nov 30, 2009)

Re: just another Thanksgiving?

Yes, we are one big happy family


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## jim baird (Nov 30, 2009)

Re: just another Thanksgiving?

Burns,

How did you manage to get that camera into our living room?


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## Mac (Dec 1, 2009)

Re: just another Thanksgiving?

"... We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by thier Creator with certian unalienable rights..."

"Well, some of us are more equal than others..."


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## jar546 (Dec 1, 2009)

Re: just another Thanksgiving?



			
				jeffc said:
			
		

> The best and fastest way to ruin and good bb is to turn everyone against one another or to start choosing up sides. Is this a political arena or a building codes forum? Now is the time to decide before this gets out of hand. My vote is to keep the forum to building code issues. Many political forums exist so I don’t understand the need or desire to proselytize on this site.


I agree with this statement.  I always said that politics and religion should be left alone when it comes time for business.  This is a business related board that is here for code enforcement.  I did not envision having religious or political posts in this area.  It is however, labeled "Other Topics".  What I would recommend is staying away from viewing any off topic threads that may have either one of these two passionate subjects.

The problem with discussing politics and/or religion is that there are some very strong view points and many buttons that can easily get pushed or misconstrued.  I would like to caution everyone to respect each other and each other's opinions.  Lets not let this get ugly.

There are moderators in place and they have the ability to censor/delete/edit posts if they  feel that any are inappropriate.


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## kilitact (Dec 2, 2009)

Re: just another Thanksgiving?

Jeff; I would agree that theirs strong feelings surrounding politics and religion, and if this forum has a thread such has open topics that allows for a forum to freely discuss these subjects, than we shouldn’t have to be censored by moderators, who because of their beliefs feel that the subject posted is inappropriate.  Xmas and thanksgiving are both considered politics and religion


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## RJJ (Dec 2, 2009)

Re: just another Thanksgiving?

Kil: I agree we should not censor! The base of this BB is like family and although we may not agree on all issues, we always have to respect each other. Since I was the one who started this thread I can remove it. I believe Jeff is only raising a warning flag! Strong opinions do emerge from such topics. If one is offend they can choose not to read and they certainly can choose not to post.

Open discussion allows all to understand each other alittle better and perhaps close the gaps they may or may not exist.   

I believe all here don't want to rent the curtain of discussion, but at the same time tread lightly on the element of personal belief.


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## jar546 (Dec 2, 2009)

Re: just another Thanksgiving?

My post is both a caution and a warning, not a decision.  It is my opinion that I too am entitled to.  As I have stated in the past, I don't believe that this board belongs to me.  It belongs to all of us.  For now as it is my website that is hosting it, I am the one bearing legal responsibility, therefore I may choose to censor or delete at my discretion if I believe that the line has been crossed.

I have personally witnessed the decline of another messageboard that was for a specific subject such as ours is.  They started to allow the discussion of religion and politics which was previously not allowed.  This cause many online arguments and other public problems.  The messageboard lost multiple members who no longer wish to participate because the focus of the board slowly changed.  The site also went from a very busy board to few posts an interaction between members not to mention several sponsors bailed on them.  All because of the allowance of political and religious discussions.

In my opinion, if you want to discuss politics or religion then go to a website that is designed and exists for that purpose.  Again, that is my opinion, not my decision.  I will not take part in these types of discussions, nor will I read them.  I only opened this one up to check on it and found exactly what I had expected.


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## TJacobs (Dec 2, 2009)

Re: just another Thanksgiving?

I agree with jar546.  The only political debate I'll take place in here is government politics related to public safety and the politics involved in the code-making process.

While I believe in free speech, there are better places to tear down our country than here.  If you want to do the aforementioned, try http://www.michaelsavage.wnd.com/ or http://www.foxnews.com/ or http://www.wnd.com/.  They will give you liberals all you can handle.   :mrgreen:


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