# ISO certified departments/agencies.



## Keystone (Nov 2, 2021)

Any of ya work for a municipality or third party agency that is ISO certified?

If so, pros & or cons?

Thoughts from any department or agency that was considering and elected not to start or complete, why?


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## fatboy (Nov 2, 2021)

Are you referring to this?

The *ISO* ® *Building* Code Effectiveness Grading Schedule (BCEGS ®) assesses community *building* codes and their enforcement, with special emphasis on mitigation of losses from natural hazards. 

The other is this.


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## Keystone (Nov 2, 2021)

fatboy said:


> Are you referring to this?
> 
> The *ISO* ® *Building* Code Effectiveness Grading Schedule (BCEGS ®) assesses community *building* codes and their enforcement, with special emphasis on mitigation of losses from natural hazards.
> 
> ...



This or similar.  









						International Organization for Standardization
					

We're ISO, the International Organization for Standardization. We develop and publish International Standards.




					www.iso.org


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## fatboy (Nov 3, 2021)

We (I) do it, only because leadership thinks we have to. I don't think so, I don't think it makes a hill of beans difference for insurances from the building side, maybe from the Fire side it does.  

I had to fight like crazy to get it back to a 4, it slipped to 5 until I could show more staff training.  If I wanted to climb any higher, I would need almost twice as many inspectors and plans examiners. Most of the country ends up in the 4-6 category from what I have understood. 

Our Fire Dept nailed a 1 the last few cycles, they has plenty of staff, and tons of training. But, they are the Fire guys after all..............


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## Inspector Gift (Nov 3, 2021)

Our Building Department used to participate in the ISO rating.  I opted out in 2011 and have not heard of any negative consequences or complaints from any of the businesses in town.

I declined to participate due to the excessive amount of time required to compile the data for ISO Report.  We estimated it would take more than 6 hours of our staff time, plus an hour or two of my own to provide accurate data.  A review of the previous reports our department had submitted during the past 2 decades revealed false information and generalized estimates.  We had previously claimed to be using checklists for all of our plan reviews, and to be using the most current code editions.  Neither was true.  We also claimed to have a structural engineer on staff - which we never have had.  And our Fire Department was reporting qualifications and practices that I know they were not factual, nor documented anywhere other than their ISO report.   I was told by the ISO Rep that there are no jurisdictions that score a perfect rating in our state.  

The deal breaker was when the ISO Rep told me that he would help us fill out the paperwork and fudge the data to keep our current rating.


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## mtlogcabin (Nov 3, 2021)

I do it to justify and get approval for a large educational/training budget. We got dinged from a 3 to a 4 on commercial and 3 to a 5 on residential the last time they where here because the state was still under the 2012 editions.

This link    https://www.isomitigation.com/bcegs/   will explain the ISO use of the information


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## Pcinspector1 (Nov 3, 2021)

A big time eater for a small department. ISO can get your administration upset by saying the insurance rates will go up for your community if your not updating to the newer codes and providing training for your staff.. You get credits if the staff went to collage, have certifications and your on the latest and newest codes.

A while back we had no new housing subdivisions and they threatened to raise the ISO rating...there's not much you can do with aging housing stock except add smokes and CO2 detectors when issuing a permit for remodeling. I thought that was unfair to threaten to raise our rating becuse we were under an older code and understaffed. Last I knew we were a 4 for residential and a 6 for commercial and teh Fire District was a 4. These are respectable numbers IMO.

Not a fan of the ISO.


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## Keystone (Nov 3, 2021)

fatboy said:


> We (I) do it, only because leadership thinks we have to. I don't think so, I don't think it makes a hill of beans difference for insurances from the building side, maybe from the Fire side it does.
> 
> I had to fight like crazy to get it back to a 4, it slipped to 5 until I could show more staff training.  If I wanted to climb any higher, I would need almost twice as many inspectors and plans examiners. Most of the country ends up in the 4-6 category from what I have understood.
> 
> Our Fire Dept nailed a 1 the last few cycles, they has plenty of staff, and tons of training. But, they are the Fire guys after all..............



1for the FD, impressive.   

Tnx for feedback.


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## Keystone (Nov 3, 2021)

Inspector Gift said:


> Our Building Department used to participate in the ISO rating.  I opted out in 2011 and have not heard of any negative consequences or complaints from any of the businesses in town.
> 
> I declined to participate due to the excessive amount of time required to compile the data for ISO Report.  We estimated it would take more than 6 hours of our staff time, plus an hour or two of my own to provide accurate data.  A review of the previous reports our department had submitted during the past 2 decades revealed false information and generalized estimates.  We had previously claimed to be using checklists for all of our plan reviews, and to be using the most current code editions.  Neither was true.  We also claimed to have a structural engineer on staff - which we never have had.  And our Fire Department was reporting qualifications and practices that I know they were not factual, nor documented anywhere other than their ISO report.   I was told by the ISO Rep that there are no jurisdictions that score a perfect rating in our state.
> 
> The deal breaker was when the ISO Rep told me that he would help us fill out the paperwork and fudge the data to keep our current rating.


Well damn, ISO Rep Drive a nail into his own coffin.


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## TheCommish (Nov 4, 2021)

We do not  participate since they take points off for not using the latest versions of ICC codes, when the commonwealth has separate Plumbing and Electrical codes not promulgated by Board of Building Regulations and the state building code is always   one or more cycles behind the ICC


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## steveray (Nov 4, 2021)

Luckily I have avoided it so far...Many of my peers have done them and alot of time spent...We are subject to statewide adoption, so whatever the State does is where we are at on that. Very few (none that I know) have a structural engineer on staff, and I have $2500 a year to train 6 licensed people...Not going to go well.


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## Keystone (Nov 4, 2021)

TheCommish said:


> We do not  participate since they take points off for not using the latest versions of ICC codes, when the commonwealth has separate Plumbing and Electrical codes not promulgated by Board of Building Regulations and the state building code is always   one or more cycles behind the ICC



I can relate to that, being in Pennsylvania we are going to move from 2015 into 2018 I Codes Feb 2022 with of course our multitude of state mandated amendments and local AHJ’s that have its own legally adopted amendments.


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## Keystone (Nov 4, 2021)

steveray said:


> Luckily I have avoided it so far...Many of my peers have done them and alot of time spent...We are subject to statewide adoption, so whatever the State does is where we are at on that. Very few (none that I know) have a structural engineer on staff, and I have $2500 a year to train 6 licensed people...Not going to go well.



6 people and $2500, certainly hope that doesn’t account for your code cycle updates and books or E Books and similar materials.


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## steveray (Nov 4, 2021)

Nope...another $2250 for books....


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## Pcinspector1 (Nov 4, 2021)

steveray, Do you have funds for coffee?


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## steveray (Nov 4, 2021)

1.4% of my budget is not "people costs".....Fuel, phones, books, education, etc...


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## mtlogcabin (Nov 4, 2021)

The ISO rating applies to what is built during


steveray said:


> and I have $2500 a year to train 6 licensed people.



I remember those days now I have about $5,000 per person and books are a different account. Luckily I am an "enterprise" fund and by state law keep all of my revenue so the council can't use it for non code enforcement expenses.


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## steveray (Nov 4, 2021)

mtlogcabin said:


> I remember those days now I have about $5,000 per person and books are a different account. Luckily I am an "enterprise" fund and by state law keep all of my revenue so the council can't use it for non code enforcement expenses.


Wish...Working on it....Took in about $1.8 million last year.....


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## Pcinspector1 (Nov 5, 2021)

steveray, $1.8 mill, you can afford to go to Starbucks for coffee!


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## jj1289 (Nov 8, 2021)

The ISO rating on the building code side MAY only affect commercial property insurance ratings. Found this out after digging around.


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## fatboy (Nov 8, 2021)

jj1289 said:


> The ISO rating on the building code side MAY only affect commercial property insurance ratings. Found this out after digging around.


Maybe, but I have heard that it relates to the Fire Dept rating, not the Building Department.


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## Pcinspector1 (Nov 8, 2021)

Storytime: Had an irate property owner call and claim his insurance rates had all most doubled on his apartment complex and he wanted to know why? What did the city do to cause this he asked? I asked a few questions and found out his insurance company was using the same city name but the wrong state, he was so relieved when he noticed it had the wrong state and he called them back to clear it up....that's what I do...young squire...that's what I do!


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