# marking of service equipment



## BSSTG (Mar 27, 2013)

Greetings,

Can someone direct me to the 2011 NEC code section that will require addresses be marked on service equipment and in what fashion? Our local provider is raising a stink. He doesn't like addresses in marksalot on apartment disconnects. Personally, I could care less how they are marked as long as I can figure out what is what.

thanksabunch

BS


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## Gregg Harris (Mar 27, 2013)

BSSTG said:
			
		

> Greetings,Can someone direct me to the 2011 NEC code section that will require addresses be marked on service equipment and in what fashion? Our local provider is raising a stink. He doesn't like addresses in marksalot on apartment disconnects. Personally, I could care less how they are marked as long as I can figure out what is what.
> 
> thanksabunch
> 
> BS


VI. Service Equipment — Disconnecting Means

230.70 General. Means shall be provided to disconnect all conductors in a building or other structure from the service-entrance conductors.

(A) Location. The service disconnecting means shall be installed in accordance with 230.70(A)(1), (A)(2), and (A)(3).

(1) Readily Accessible Location. The service disconnecting means shall be installed at a readily accessible location either outside of a building or structure or inside nearest the point of entrance of the service conductors.

(2) Bathrooms. Service disconnecting means shall not be installed in bathrooms.

(3) Remote Control. Where a remote control device(s) is used to actuate the service disconnecting means, the service disconnecting means shall be located in accordance with 230.70(A)(1).

(B) Marking. Each service disconnect shall be permanently marked to identify it as a service disconnect.

© Suitable for Use. Each service disconnecting means shall be suitable for the prevailing conditions. Service equipment installed in hazardous (classified) locations shall comply with the requirements of Articles 500 through 517.


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## steveray (Mar 27, 2013)

"shall be permanently marked"......indoors marks a lot is probably not a problem....we have been asking for and mostly getting engraved plastic labels where it is required.....outdoors magic marker just does not last....


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## cda (Mar 27, 2013)

From IFC 2009

605.3.1 Labeling. Doors into electrical control panel rooms shall be marked with a plainly visible and legible sign stating ELECTRICAL ROOM or similar approved wording. The disconnecting means for each service, feeder or branch circuit originating on a switchboard or panelboard shall be legibly and durably marked to indicate its purpose unless such purpose is clearly evident.


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## Gregg Harris (Mar 27, 2013)

steveray said:
			
		

> "shall be permanently marked"......indoors marks a lot is probably not a problem....we have been asking for and mostly getting engraved plastic labels where it is required.....outdoors magic marker just does not last....


Paint pens work well both in and out


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## mark handler (Mar 27, 2013)

None answer the OP question, Is the address on the panel required?


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## BSSTG (Mar 27, 2013)

mark handler said:
			
		

> None answer the OP question, Is the address on the panel required?


Yea, this guy from the power provider left me a message something about a plaque with addresses required where services are banked. I had talked to him briefly this am and told him I don't make up rules to enforce. That's when he called me back with the message. I don't want to call him back til I have my ducks in line. This guy is known for some really srewy interpretations too. Not to mention he's more of a "problem creator" as opposed to a "problem solver".

thanks all

BSSTG


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## Gregg Harris (Mar 27, 2013)

mark handler said:
			
		

> None answer the OP question, Is the address on the panel required?


NEC 230.70 (B) (B) Marking. Each service disconnect shall be permanently marked to identify it as a service disconnect.


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## Dennis (Mar 27, 2013)

Why is the power company requiring this- it is not their jurisdiction.  I don't know of anything in the NEC requiring specifically what you ask.


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## fatboy (Mar 27, 2013)

Our provider requires that the units be identified, so we do also. Usually see phenolic plates or brass tags.

And, it's their meter that does, or does not get set, depending on what they want to see, so it is pretty much their call.


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## BSSTG (Mar 27, 2013)

Dennis said:
			
		

> Why is the power company requiring this- it is not their jurisdiction.  I don't know of anything in the NEC requiring specifically what you ask.


That's my point. I understand that the power company requires addresses to be marked. The point is this guy (provider) wants me to go tell someone that he requires the marking and marksalot is not acceptable. I was just wondering if there is something I'm missing here. Like I said, if I can't find it in writing, I don't make up rules. We have enough already.

BSSTG


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## north star (Mar 27, 2013)

*= + =*

BSSTG,

**Greg Harris** has provided the correct Article from the NEC [ `11 edition ].

Also, see Article 230.2(E) [ RE: plaques ].

*= + =*


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## Gregg Harris (Mar 27, 2013)

north star said:
			
		

> *= + =*BSSTG,
> 
> **Greg Harris** has provided the correct Article from the NEC [ `11 edition ].
> 
> ...


(E) Identification. Where a building or structure is supplied by more than one service, or any combination of branch circuits, feeders, and services, a permanent plaque or directory shall be installed at each service disconnect location denoting all other services, feeders, and branch circuits supplying that building or structure and the area served by each. See 225.37.

225.37 Identification. Where a building or structure has any combination of feeders, branch circuits, or services passing through it or supplying it, a permanent plaque or directory shall be installed at each feeder and branch-circuit disconnect location denoting all other services, feeders, or branch circuits supplying that building or structure or passing through that building or structure and the area served by each.

I feel like Rodney Dangerfield


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## BSSTG (Mar 27, 2013)

[/size][/color]**Greg Harris** has provided the correct Article from the NEC [ `11 edition ].

Also, see Article 230.2(E) [ RE: plaques ]

that's the one the dude is referring to. 

thanks

BSSTG


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## north star (Mar 27, 2013)

** **( )** **





> "I feel like Rodney Dangerfield"


The Rodney Dangerfield "being dead" feeling, or the Rodney Dangerfield"I don't get no respect" feeling?  

**** ( ) ****


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## Gregg Harris (Mar 27, 2013)

north star said:
			
		

> ** **( )** **The Rodney Dangerfield "being dead" feeling, or the Rodney Dangerfield
> 
> "I don't get no respect" feeling?
> 
> **** ( ) ****


Let's choose both since one makes you feel like the other


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## north star (Mar 27, 2013)

*+ +*

Rodney was THE MAN !......What a great comic/actor!

*+ +*


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## cda (Mar 27, 2013)

Since it is the provider requiring the item,,,

Ask him nicely to provide the requirement he is cites to you in writing, so you can show it to other people you enforce

Then wait to see if it appears


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## BSSTG (Mar 27, 2013)

cda said:
			
		

> Since it is the provider requiring the item,,,Ask him nicely to provide the requirement he is cites to you in writing, so you can show it to other people you enforce
> 
> Then wait to see if it appears


This fellow is a real pain. I went round and round with him a couple of years ago. They were not going to ok a service reconnect if the meter was within 3' of a window. Absolutely crazy. Somehow they interpreted the "no open conductors" within 3' of a window. I finally convinced them they were all blanked up. Before it was over with, they cost several folks a lot of money moving the service equipment away from windows. I really get fired up with folks that make interpretations that are crazy and cost folks money. And to pile on, I hate it when inspectors make up rules as they go along. I just don't believe in that. I may work for the government, but I'm still a proud capitalist at heart!

once again, thanks to all

BSSTG


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## Dennis (Mar 28, 2013)

BSSTG said:
			
		

> This fellow is a real pain. I went round and round with him a couple of years ago. They were not going to ok a service reconnect if the meter was within 3' of a window. Absolutely crazy. Somehow they interpreted the "no open conductors" within 3' of a window. BSSTG


Unfortunately that is a common misinterpretation .  I have had to show a few inspectors over the years that they were not correct.

I guess I wasn't quite understanding the original question.  Another issue that is often misunderstood is what constitutes a service.  Two meters does not necessarily mean two services.  I have never seen a plaque mounted when there was on service with multiple meters.


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## steveray (Mar 28, 2013)

Dennis said:
			
		

> Unfortunately that is a common misinterpretation .  I have had to show a few inspectors over the years that they were not correct.I guess I wasn't quite understanding the original question.  Another issue that is often misunderstood is what constitutes a service.  Two meters does not necessarily mean two services.  I have never seen a plaque mounted when there was on service with multiple meters.


We get those mistakes here too.....as well as the people (including licensed electricians) that think that every panel is a service....


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## Inspector 102 (Mar 28, 2013)

I thought I made a mistake once, then realized I was wrong. Seriously, I try to inspect as the code allows and not allow my opinion to enter into the equation. I have read code section with electricians many times until we both agree on what the language is actually saying. Some of the neighboring jurisdicitons have used the "because I said so" inspection approach and it burns me. As a government employee also, I get frustrated when people go beyond their "authority" to get what they want. I do not have the authority to make the code, I have the responsiblity to enforce what is law. After ranting, I do require the disconnects to be labeled to indicate what tenant space the disconnect is servicing but I do accept a markalot. Never thought about a paint pen, maybe I will start carrying one. Makes it a lot easier if the firefighters show up since they are not the smartest group and I say that because I am one.


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