# Closed cell spray foam



## Bruce Chirre (Oct 17, 2019)

Hi, my name's Bruce.   I'm in the middle of getting my building permit to remodel my brother in law's commercial building that he will be leasing me.  It used to be a flower shop and I'm going to make it into a convenience store.  
My brother already gutted the building and removed all partitioning walls and fixtures, it's basically a shell not even a ceiling it had a hanging ceiling.  Ok so my question is I want to have a open look for the ceiling and there is no insulation on the roof so to insulate it I'm hiring a spray foam company to foam the ceiling to r38 and then I was just going to spray paint it and call it a day?  My ceiling is only 10 feet tall so I'm trying to make it look bigger by not putting anything over it..  I'm in Portland Oregon.  Any fire code or maybe health code I might run into a snag?  I'm going to have a deli too.

Thank you


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## Bruce Chirre (Oct 17, 2019)

I thought I'd throw out there this is a one story 100% steel building 1600 sq ft


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## Paul Sweet (Oct 17, 2019)

Exposed spray foam is usually a fire hazard and prohibited by code.  It's possible there are some intumescent coatings that could be applied over it


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## e hilton (Oct 17, 2019)

Google “K-13 spray insulation”.


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## my250r11 (Oct 17, 2019)

Could always redo the roof with the correct R value for your area.


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## mtlogcabin (Oct 17, 2019)

Increasing the insulation value of a roof increases the snow loads on that roof. I see Portland uses 20 PSF snow load which is not a lot but you might want to check if the increase in insulation will create additional snow loads that exceed the original roof design.


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## cda (Oct 17, 2019)

Can he spray the insulation, and than coat it with a non flammable???


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## cda (Oct 17, 2019)

Bruce Chirre said:


> Hi, my name's Bruce.   I'm in the middle of getting my building permit to remodel my brother in law's commercial building that he will be leasing me.  It used to be a flower shop and I'm going to make it into a convenience store.
> My brother already gutted the building and removed all partitioning walls and fixtures, it's basically a shell not even a ceiling it had a hanging ceiling.  Ok so my question is I want to have a open look for the ceiling and there is no insulation on the roof so to insulate it I'm hiring a spray foam company to foam the ceiling to r38 and then I was just going to spray paint it and call it a day?  My ceiling is only 10 feet tall so I'm trying to make it look bigger by not putting anything over it..  I'm in Portland Oregon.  Any fire code or maybe health code I might run into a snag?  I'm going to have a deli too.
> 
> Thank you




Any food prep or exposed food. not in packages?


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## Rick18071 (Oct 18, 2019)

So what did the architect show on the approved building plans? You are not allowed to design it unless you are the certified architect for this job.


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## Bruce Chirre (Oct 18, 2019)

@cda yes I will be making food so exposed food for sure.@rick18071  I didn't use a architect it's not required for commercial buildings less than 3000 sq ft in inner city Portland.


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## e hilton (Oct 18, 2019)

Bruce Chirre said:


> I didn't use a architect it's not required for commercial buildings less than 3000 sq ft in inner city Portland.


Well that sounds like an invitation to trouble.  No offense to the OP but that opens the door to all manner of errors.    And failed inspections.


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## Bruce Chirre (Oct 21, 2019)

Found the spray on fire proofing Dc315,. Just spray it on and we're all good thanks everyone.  Especially Paul Sweet.  Intumescent coatings was the ticket. Now I don't have to have that nasty drop ceiling


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## tmurray (Oct 21, 2019)

We see DC315 quite a bit. Make sure the contractor has used the product before.


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## Bruce Chirre (Oct 21, 2019)

I'll be doing it myself can't be that hard.  Called around and they wanna charge 4000 for 1500 sqft and it's only 300 bucks for a 5 gallon bucket.  I might as well buy  the spray machine for it. And do it myself.  Great help guys thanks.


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## e hilton (Oct 21, 2019)

There’s a reason they charge $4000 ... hope you don’t learn the hard way.  I imagine overspray and cleanup takes a toll.   I have no experience with that stuff, but i have read that spray foam insulation is tricky to do right ... too thick and it goes bad.  Wonder what the tricks are for this product.  I assume you have worked out the coverage vs thickness equation per gallon ...


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## JPohling (Oct 22, 2019)

Bruce Chirre said:


> Found the spray on fire proofing Dc315,. Just spray it on and we're all good thanks everyone.  Especially Paul Sweet.  Intumescent coatings was the ticket. Now I don't have to have that nasty drop ceiling


Guaranteed that the exposed insulation will not comply with health requirements for a scrubbable/washable ceiling.  You will need to do something different in the food prep areas like a lay in ceiling below with the appropriate tiles.  How is the accessibility?  This is a change in use so it may as well be new construction and will need to comply.


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## Bruce Chirre (Oct 22, 2019)

Health code only says ceilings need to be one of the following Stainless steel, Plastic coated or metal clad fiberboard, Dry-wall epoxy, Glazed surface ,Plastic laminate.  So I'm gonna spray paint the thermal barrier with some glossy paint.


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## e hilton (Oct 22, 2019)

You know what ... you’re starting to bother me.  Why?   Because it's obvious you’re trying to cut every corner possible to finish out that space without regard for building code or safety.  Your last post says you’re going to spray glossy paint on the insulation to meet sanitary requirements.  Have you read the manufacturers spec sheet?   You cant use regular paint because that adds a source of fuel, it has to be sprayed with an intumescent paint.  

So you’re going to apply it yourself to save money, then you’re going to spray it with cheap paint from home depot to save money, then you’re going to get red tagged by a sharp eyed inspector, and then you’re going to post on facebook about how mean and unreasonable the evil city government is.


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## JPohling (Oct 23, 2019)

Bruce Chirre said:


> Health code only says ceilings need to be one of the following Stainless steel, Plastic coated or metal clad fiberboard, Dry-wall epoxy, Glazed surface ,Plastic laminate.  So I'm gonna spray paint the thermal barrier with some glossy paint.


That will not work on many levels


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## Bruce Chirre (Jul 1, 2020)

Everything worked and passed inspection spray foam and dc315 for my whole building plus kitchen.  Thanks for the help.


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## VillageInspector (Jul 6, 2020)

e hilton said:


> You know what ... you’re starting to bother me.  Why?   Because it's obvious you’re trying to cut every corner possible to finish out that space without regard for building code or safety.  Your last post says you’re going to spray glossy paint on the insulation to meet sanitary requirements.  Have you read the manufacturers spec sheet?   You cant use regular paint because that adds a source of fuel, it has to be sprayed with an intumescent paint.
> 
> So you’re going to apply it yourself to save money, then you’re going to spray it with cheap paint from home depot to save money, then you’re going to get red tagged by a sharp eyed inspector, and then you’re going to post on facebook about how mean and unreasonable the evil city government is.



You just can't help some people. We both know, despite his temporary victory, that this is not going to end well.


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## ameliasolis (Aug 28, 2022)

Bruce Chirre said:


> Hi, my name's Bruce.   I'm in the middle of getting my building permit to remodel my brother in law's commercial building that he will be leasing me.  It used to be a flower shop and I'm going to make it into a convenience store.
> My brother already gutted the building and removed all partitioning walls and fixtures, it's basically a shell not even a ceiling it had a hanging ceiling.  Ok so my question is I want to have a open look for the ceiling and there is no insulation on the roof so to insulate it I'm hiring a spray foam company to foam the ceiling to r38 and then I was just going to spray paint it and call it a day?  My ceiling is only 10 feet tall so I'm trying to make it look bigger by not putting anything over it..  I'm in Portland Oregon.  Any fire code or maybe health code I might run into a snag?  I'm going to have a deli too.
> 
> Thank you


I am in the planning stages of a new cabin build. One of the reasons I am building a new one is because the current cabin in not insulated so it is too hot in the summer and too cold in the winter.
I want a cabin we can use year-round.
I thought closed-cell spray foam would be a good idea. I got a quote to insulate a 20x20 cabin.
The quote was for closed cell foam 3" thick in the walls, floor, and roof.
The price was 8,000. It seems really high to me. can anyone give me the price per square foot that they paid for foam?
Has anyone used a DIY kit to insulate their cabin?


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## ameliasolis (Aug 28, 2022)

ameliasolis said:


> I am in the planning stages of a new cabin build. One of the reasons I am building a new one is because the current cabin in not insulated so it is too hot in the summer and too cold in the winter.
> I want a cabin we can use year-round.
> I thought closed-cell spray foam would be a good idea. I got a quote to insulate a 20x20 cabin.
> The quote was for closed cell foam 3" dmvfoam.com thick in the walls, floor, and roof.
> ...


thanks in advance for any feedback


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## Msradell (Aug 28, 2022)

Unfortunately that pricing sounds about right, however it is worth it!  I'm not sure what R-value they are quoting you for that but what we had was quoted as R-8 and we put in about 4" when we remodeled our bathroom over the garage.  It made a huge difference!  I didn't try nor do I know anyone who has tried the DIY kits but after watching them I'm not sure I would want to either. It's quite a messy process and you have to spray in layers. Also since it expands you have to be careful about not getting too much in the cavity.


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## Paul Sweet (Aug 29, 2022)

It's not for DYI.  Some ingredients are toxic, and you have to wear a bunny suit and respirator while applying it.  The chemicals have to be mixed within the specified temperature range and at the correct ratio.  I think that some foams have to be applied in multiple layers of 1/2" thickness at a time so they won't get too hot as they cure.


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