# Maintenance of ADA installations?



## RJJ (Nov 24, 2009)

Another code official stated that the local inspecters are required to make sure that ada improvements are to be maintained. I do not see a requirement for perpetual inspection of such issues. Example: Parking lot signage or Braille exit signs at egress doors which fall off.

The placement of shelves after one has signed off on a project. I am sure many have seen changes after CO's have been issued. Is there such a section that requires this? :roll:


----------



## globe trekker (Nov 24, 2009)

Re: Maintenance of ADA installations?

RJJ,

Ultimately it is the responsibility of the property owner to maintain the ADA environment.      If your jurisdiction has adopted and enforces the IPMC, then Sections 101.2 - Scope;   101.3 - Intent;  102.2 - Maintenance and 102.3 - Application of other codes would apply, and would provide you with "enforcement teeth".


----------



## Gene Boecker (Nov 24, 2009)

Re: Maintenance of ADA installations?

Agreed.

Unless there is some other work that requires a review per Chapter 34 or the IEBC the only thing to use are the provisions in the IPMC.  The owner/operator has the responsibility to maintain access under federal provisions.  There is no federal provision that involves the building inspectors or building officials in that process.


----------



## north star (Nov 24, 2009)

Re: Maintenance of ADA installations?

*Some people HAVE "dropped a dime / quarter / 50 cents"  on the property owner,*

*and let the Feds deal with `em.   *


----------



## High Desert (Nov 24, 2009)

Re: Maintenance of ADA installations?

Since it is "maintenance," I believe it belongs in the fire code and should be the responsibility of the fire code official to ensure they are maintained in compliance with the code.

Maybe a code change is in order.


----------



## Gene Boecker (Nov 24, 2009)

Re: Maintenance of ADA installations?

Gary,

The Fire Code doesn't address anything related to accessibility (other than accessible means of egress).  That's why it's in the IPMC.


----------



## High Desert (Nov 24, 2009)

Re: Maintenance of ADA installations?

Gene, if you noticed I had a "wink" symbol on my post. It was all in *"pun."*


----------



## globe trekker (Nov 24, 2009)

Re: Maintenance of ADA installations?

High Desert,

We just haven't gotten used to your subtlies yet!


----------



## High Desert (Nov 24, 2009)

Re: Maintenance of ADA installations?

globe trekker: I thought my Popeye avatar was a pretty good clue to my subtle sense of humor.


----------



## RJJ (Nov 24, 2009)

Re: Maintenance of ADA installations?

This concept came from a State auditor! They over see ADA! Right now there seems to be a witch hunt starting and now we are suppose to maintain inspection for compliance of ADA. Yet no chapter and verse exists. This is becoming a JOKE in PA. No pun intended. :roll:


----------



## mtlogcabin (Nov 24, 2009)

Re: Maintenance of ADA installations?



> The Fire Code doesn't address anything related to accessibility (other than accessible means of egress).


That would cover the Braille signs related to exiting  

Chapter 10 in the fire code does cover handrails, protruding objects, door hardware and a lot of other issues so even though it was a tounge in cheek response if the FD was trained in some of these issues for their annual inspections then they could require corrections as related to the requirements of Chapter 10.


----------



## Gene Boecker (Nov 24, 2009)

Re: Maintenance of ADA installations?

Sorry I missed the "wink" Gary!   

The state auditor needs to tell you how they are authorizing anyone to enforce a federal requirement at the local level which has no local or state authority built into the Title III provisions.  There ARE Title II provisions for local governments as they apply to government buildings and facilities (including sidewalks and public swimming pools).  But someone needs to tell you who is authorized to enforce/review for that.  THAT is usually left up the local elected officials to decide.


----------



## Big Mac (Dec 4, 2009)

Re: Maintenance of ADA installations?

Check out Section 3409.2


----------



## Gene Boecker (Dec 4, 2009)

Re: Maintenance of ADA installations?

Big Mac, good point.  But that section doesn't indicate who - other than the owner/tenant - is responsible for enforcing the fact that the facility must be maintained accessible.  That section can be used if there is a renovation that happens and the plans examiner or inspector notices that there is a change from the original installation that reduces accessibility.  If that isn't picked up because the designer didn't flag it or because the owner did it without a permit (*gasp*       ) then there's no way to know.

How many plan reviewers go back and compare the renovation drawings to the original plans that were filed?  Anyone?  Bueller?


----------



## Dan (Dec 4, 2009)

Re: Maintenance of ADA installations?

In our city the code enforcement division of the planning dept. regulates the outdoor signage. The bldg. dept. has no way to go back after C of O is issued unless a complaint is requested and there has been a devation from the approved plans done without an permit.As far as exiting and exit signs inside the bldg. are concerned the Fire dept. will do annual inspections.

Dan


----------



## Big Mac (Dec 4, 2009)

Re: Maintenance of ADA installations?

Actually Gene, I had that very thing happen today.  (Doesn't happen very often however)  I had a tenant improvement submitted on a building that had 2' 8" exit doors.  Even though I was quite sure that condition was ever code compliant, I went back and checked the 1970 UBC, (the code under which the original approval was given) just to be sure.  The code requirements in that code were very similar to todays with regard to exiting.  How those doors ever got it there is apparently a mystery, but I'm pretty sure that conditin is going to be addressed now.


----------



## Rick18071 (Dec 4, 2009)

Re: Maintenance of ADA installations?

I went to a gas station today that I finaled and they got the C.O two days ago. It is a self service with only a small booth with a place for the casher and an accessable rest room. I went to use the rest room and the unisex sign was gone and the door was locked. I asked the casher to use the rest room and he said that there is none. I told him I knew there is one and insisted to use it. He unlocked it and it was full of boxes. I could not even go in it. I Can't even tell if the water closet is still there. I wish I could do somthing about it!


----------



## High Desert (Dec 4, 2009)

Re: Maintenance of ADA installations?

rick, you can if you want to file a complaint with the Department of Justice.


----------



## Rick18071 (Dec 8, 2009)

Re: Maintenance of ADA installations?

No way! Let them get sued. But no knows that there is a rest room but me.


----------



## JBI (Dec 8, 2009)

Re: Maintenance of ADA installations?

They will after you write a 'letter to the editor' in your local newspaper!  :twisted:


----------



## Paul Sweet (Dec 10, 2009)

Re: Maintenance of ADA installations?

Big Mac, I believe that in the early 1970s "clear width" was interpreted as being the width of the door leaf, and stops or the projection of the partly opened door were ignored.  It was in the early 1980s that codes started using the term "clear opening", so you needed a 2'-10" door with special hinges or a 3'-0" door to achieve the 32" "clear opening".  Pairs of 2'-6" or 2'-8" doors were very common then, and met code.


----------



## Big Mac (Dec 14, 2009)

Re: Maintenance of ADA installations?

To a certain extent I would agree Paul, but in this case we are talking about individual doors, not pairs of doors.


----------

