# Commercial Generator Installation



## Alias (Jun 23, 2011)

A commercial generator with a Volvo truck engine has been installed in my jurisdiction.  I think that it is military surplus (no manual).  I am unable to find manufacturer markings, etc., just a model and serial number.  It was installed without permits or consulting me about the installation.  :censored

I have a couple of questions, and will post pictures from home this afternoon after I resize them.

How much clearance is needed in front of the control panel?  Current set-up is 30" between control panel and tank.  The tank is set with the fuel lines facing the control panel side of the generator.  The main switch is around the back.

Fuel lines - buried or not?  What type, copper or flex?


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## north star (Jun 23, 2011)

** * * **

What type of fuel being supplied to the generator - gasoline,

diesel, natural gas, liquid propane, fuel oil, other ?

The 30" clearance between the generator and the fuel

tank sounds too close to me.

Table 110.26 in the `08 NEC,  appears to indicate a minimum

of 36" clearance is required at the control panel.

** * * **


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## Alias (Jun 23, 2011)

north star said:
			
		

> ** * * **What type of fuel being supplied to the generator - gasoline,
> 
> diesel, natural gas, liquid propane, fuel oil, other ?
> 
> ...


Diesel, run through copper tubing.  Wait til you see the pictures........


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## mtlogcabin (Jun 23, 2011)

is the generator emergency power?


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## codeworks (Jun 23, 2011)

I'd approach this from Article 445, of the NEC, standing on section 445.11.  Once that information was supplied, i'd pick the ball back up until then. NO GO on the install, Don't run it, use it or anything, put it all in writing, so that y.a.i.c.


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## cda (Jun 23, 2011)

What type of diesel tank

What size

Ul listed???

Etc


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## north star (Jun 23, 2011)

** * * **

Sue,

This application of yorn is quickly growing by leaps and bounds.

Diesel fuel, I am told, is a Class II combustible liquid.......Ch. 34,

from the `06 IFC is for Flammable & Combustible Liquids.

*Section **3404.2.9 Above-ground tanks.* 

Above-ground storage of flammable and combustible

liquids in tanks shall comply with Section 3404.2 and

Sections 3404.2.9.1 through 3404.2.9.6.10.

*Table 3403.1.1 -*

3403.1.1 Classified locations for flammable liquids.



Areas where flammable liquids are stored, handled, dispensed or mixed

shall be in accordance with Table 3403.1.1. A classified area shall not

extend beyond an unpierced floor, roof or other solid partition.



The extent of the classified area is allowed to be reduced, or

eliminated, where sufficient technical justification is provided to the

fire code official that a concentration in the area in excess of 25

percent of the lower flammable limit (LFL) cannot be generated.

*TABLE 3403.1.1 CLASS I ELECTRICAL EQUIPMENT LOCATIONSa*

*LOCATION*

*GROUP D DIVISION*

*EXTENT OF CLASSIFIED AREA*

*Tank—Above ground*

*Shell, ends or roof and dike area*



*Vent*



Floating roof1

2

1

2

1

Area inside dike where dike height is greater than the distance from the tank to the dike for more than 50 percent of the tank circumference.

Area within 10 feet from shell, ends or roof of tank. Area inside dikes to level of top of dike.

Area within 5 feet of open end of vent, extending in all directions.

Area between 5 feet and 10 feet from open end of vent, extending in all directions.

Area above the roof and within the shell.





For SI: 1 inch = 25.4 mm, 1 foot = 304.8 mm.a. Locations as classified in the ICC _Electrical Code_.b. When classifying extent of area, consideration shall be given to the fact that tank cars or tank vehicles can be spotted at varying points. Therefore, the extremities of the loading or unloading positions shall be used.c. The release of Class I liquids can generate vapors to the extent that the entire building, and possibly a zone surrounding it, are considered a Class I, Division 2 location.

Will this do for a start ?

** * * **


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## Alias (Jun 23, 2011)

Here are the pictures.........  Need I say more?  BTW, the electrical is done, it is all underground, and this is for emergency power.
	

		
			
		

		
	

View attachment 986
View attachment 985
View attachment 984

	

		
			
		

		
	
I just love the fuel lines............  

View attachment 447


View attachment 448


View attachment 449


View attachment 447


View attachment 448


View attachment 449


/monthly_2011_06/572953c01e74b_generator002x.jpg.fbbcae77e396298e1358810f906b89fe.jpg

/monthly_2011_06/572953c022018_generator001x.jpg.4ad7e8dbb6c095e2efc82060f6b48ea1.jpg

/monthly_2011_06/572953c024d43_generator003x.jpg.72870baa056b6ff31d6c6d23e522e7a1.jpg


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## Alias (Jun 23, 2011)

mtlogcabin said:
			
		

> is the generator emergency power?


yes, generator is outside, no building.


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## Alias (Jun 23, 2011)

cda said:
			
		

> What type of diesel tank What size
> 
> Ul listed???
> 
> Etc


Above ground on a stand, 250 gallon tank, UL - probably not but FM approved.  Also, tank needs to have siesmic straps.


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## mtlogcabin (Jun 23, 2011)

We would require the generator to be anchored to resist seismic. Looks like it is just sitting on a gravel pad

Look at the section below for different requirements depending on what is being powered.

2009 IFC

SECTION 604

EMERGENCY AND STANDBY POWER SYSTEMS


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## mark handler (Jun 23, 2011)

With any copper pipes a low-sulphur or sulphur-free diesel fuel must be used.

Fuels with a sulphur content > 1.0 %(m/m)should not be use with copper pipe due to high corrosion


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## mark handler (Jun 23, 2011)

Sue

That tank will not hold up to any quake. It looks like it's on foam?

Looks like there is a truck backed up to it, what protection is provided?

No Pad?

NEC 225 Branch Circuits and Feeders

NEC 240 Overcurrent Protection

NEC 250 Grounding

NEC 445 Generators

NEC 700 Emergency Systems

NEC 701 Legally Required Standby

NEC 702 Optional Standby

NFPA 37 Installation & Use of Stationary Engines


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## Alias (Jun 24, 2011)

mark handler said:
			
		

> SueThat tank will not hold up to any quake. It looks like it's on foam?
> 
> _* _No, flat concrete 'pads', think pavers._*_
> 
> ...


Licensed electrician who has done a couple of these already did the underground electrical work and its hooked to the panel.  There is an emergency cut-off button (red) by the control panel in picture 1.  Where the button and control panel are located is where there is only a 30" clearance to the tank.  FM was consulted on at least the tank placement, and is now not very happy where the tank was installed in relation to the generator.

I can't believe that no one even asked me what was required, they just went ahead and did it.  Oh, and it will be being tested by someone from out of town next Tuesday..............


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