# Lolly columns?



## Pcinspector1

The framer said he would put a couple of lolly columns under the floor for support. I said what? Whats a lolly column?

While whatching This Old House, I remember Norm saying the same thing. Must be an East Coast thing!

Maybe there should be a definition page?

Whats a jack?

pc1


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## rktect 1

Thin hollow metal column with concrete poured inside.

Didn't we go over this recently?


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## Coug Dad

Lally column From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

A lally column is round thin walled structural steel column oriented vertically to provide support to beams or timbers stretching over long spans. A lally column is filled with concrete to prevent buckling. The advantage of a lally column over conventional structural steel is the ability to cut it to length on a construction site with simple hand tools such as a plumber’s pipe cutter. Lally columns are generally not as strong or durable as conventional structural steel columns. The term “lally column” is sometimes incorrectly used in reference to other types of prefabricated steel columns1.

The lally column is named after an U. S. inventor, John Lally, who owned a construction company that started production of these columns in the late 19th century. He resided in Waltham, Massachusetts and Boston during the period 1898 through 1907. He was issued four U. S. Patents on composite columns: #61472, #869869, #901453,and #905888. Pat. #869869 was assigned to the U. S. Column Company of Cambridge, MA.


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## Jobsaver

rktect 1 said:
			
		

> Didn't we go over this recently?


?????????????????????link?

This article may be relevant. (not a legal column) http://www.octoberhome.com/articles/adjustcolumn/adjustcolumn.html


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## Pcinspector1

I was right, it's an east cost thing. (Boston Mass.) I did not know they were to be filled with concrete.

In this application adjustable steel columns were used, supplied by the steel beam yard.


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## khsmith55

Jobsavers link is great (print it out for your files) I have handed it out to contractors many times when they wanted to use adjustible columns instead of column details provided. When asked for the evaulation report they typically come back a few days later stating they will install the columns as detailed. Lesson, ask for the specfic es Report before permitting them.


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## Mark K

Lally columns at one time refered to columns manufactured by a given company.  Now the term is used to refer to a variety of columns.  Thus depending on the individuals idea of a lally column you might get several different products.  There is no standard for this product.

While the concrete may allow the use of thinner steel I believe that the original motivation for the concrete fill was to improve performance during fire.

Regarding the suggestion that this allows for a smaller column I will suggest that if you use steel pipe (ASTM A53) which is readily availible the lally column will not be significantly smaller.  In fact I believe most lally columns are manufactured using pipe.


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## Pcinspector1

Jack:

1)Plumbers term for roof flashing with rubber boot.

2)Shinglers term for the bracket that holds a walking board plank while on the roof.

3)A devise to raise or lower something, (house jack).

4)Other?

Whats a "watchamacallit"?


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## Coug Dad

Jack:

http://fastfood.ocregister.com/files/2008/06/jack_portrait_web.jpg


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## bgingras

what do you call them in your neck of the woods...Lally column is a term I see on plans all the time. It's all we use around here, coupled with springfield plates to mount them in place.


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## NH09

I've always called them lally columns myself, but seen a few variations of the name on plans. I have to admit I don't see many of the springfield plates around here, although I think it's a much better connection than the regular flat plates.


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## DRP

Pcinspector1 said:
			
		

> Jack: 1)Plumbers term for roof flashing with rubber boot.
> 
> 2)Shinglers term for the bracket that holds a walking board plank while on the roof.
> 
> 3)A devise to raise or lower something, (house jack).
> 
> 4)Other?
> 
> Whats a "watchamacallit"?


4) The "short" stud(s) supporting a header..trimmers

More aside info;

I took my caliper to one job and measured the thickness of what we call a BOCA post, a hollow steel column with an adjusting screw (which is either put down in the pour or welded if up). These are one piece adjustable columns with an ESR. The BO had rejected our plan to use steel pipe. The BOCA post was thinner steel than schedule 40 pipe. The BOCA post is also supposed to be primed inside and out, it had been shot from each end but was not fully primed inside.


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## TJacobs

Jack:

5) Jack Daniels


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## JBI

*SECTION 1915 CONCRETE-FILLED PIPE COLUMNS*

*1915.1 General.* Concrete-filled pipe columns shall be manufactured from standard, extra-strong or double-extra-strong steel pipe or tubing that is filled with concrete so placed and manipulated as to secure maximum density and to ensure complete filling of the pipe without voids.

*1915.2 Design.* The safe supporting capacity of concrete-filled pipe columns shall be computed in accordance with the _approved _rules or as determined by a test.

*1915.3 Connections*. Caps, base plates and connections shall be of _approved _types and shall be positively attached to the shell and anchored to the concrete core. Welding of brackets without mechanical anchorage shall be prohibited. Where the pipe is slotted to accommodate webs of brackets or other connections, the integrity of the shell shall be restored by welding to ensure hooping action of the composite section.

*1915.4 Reinforcement.* To increase the safe load-supporting capacity of concrete-filled pipe columns, the steel reinforcement shall be in the form of rods, structural shapes or pipe embedded in the concrete core with sufficient clearance to ensure the composite action of the section, but not nearer than 1 inch (25 mm) to the exterior steel shell. Structural shapes used as reinforcement shall be milled to ensure bearing on cap and base plates.

*1915.5 Fire-resistance-rating protection.* Pipe columns shall be of such size or so protected as to develop the required fire-resistance ratings specified in Table 601. Where an outer steel shell is used to enclose the fire protective covering, the shell shall not be included in the calculations for strength of the column section. The minimum diameter of pipe columns shall be 4 inches (102 mm) except that in structures of Type V construction not exceeding three _stories above_ _grade plane_ or 40 feet (12 192 mm) in _building height_, pipe columns used in basements and as secondary steel members shall have a minimum diameter of 3 inches (76 mm).

*1915.6 Approvals.* Details of column connections and splices shall be shop fabricated by _approved _methods and shall be _approved _only after tests in accordance with the _approved _rules. Shop-fabricated concrete-filled pipe columns shall be inspected by the _building official_ or by an _approved _representative of the manufacturer at the plant.

You guys make being a smart @$$ much too easy... ;-)


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## JBI

BTW, not too many of the adjustable posts are rated for permamnent installation...


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## KZQuixote

Coug Dad said:
			
		

> Jack:http://fastfood.ocregister.com/files/2008/06/jack_portrait_web.jpg


I used to see steel columns on the East coast all the time. We called them lolly columns but they were never filled with concrete. Instead they had a set of tabs that were simply bent around the lower flange of a steel beam, this at the top. At the bottom there was a threaded adjustable end that was poured in the slab once it was adjusted to the ideal height.

For your definitive Jack you have to visit:





Bill


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## Architect1281

"Lally" Columns were and are produced by "Dean Column" of Lil ol RI where they started in the day of Grandpa

her is thier web sit with some nice load tables an details

http://www.deancolumn.com/?gclid=CMXKv5fggqcCFYSK4AodoBKbeA

the simple ones are gauge steel forms that hold concrete in compression.

the concern I have had and rejected some on site as both designer and inspector is

WHen the delivery truck unloads by backing up and applying the brakes to allow the load to softly land on the ground

you can't quite tell if the concrete in the tube may have cracked - so handling is an issue

Also have the proper ESR Reports and some really good quality Bearing cab and base conditions


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