# Smooth, Hard, Nonabsorbent Surface



## Francis Vineyard (Jul 30, 2018)

Would you approve textured fabric back vinyl within 2 feet of service sinks, urinals and water closets?
Have not seen the proposed material, but aware we would approve painted CMU walls that have pits, crevices and thick grout borders.



"Ordinary dirt spots can be removed with a mild soap, warm water, and if necessary, a bristle brush to remove dirt from the crevices of deeply textured patterns. Clean from the bottom of the wall upward to protect the baseboard and prevent streaking. Rinse thoroughly with clean water from the top down using a sponge. Deeply embossed wallcoverings need extra attention in the event that suds or loosened dirt lodges in depressed surfaces. Blot wallcovering dry with a soft, lint-free towel. For more difficult stains that are only surface deep, the use of a stronger detergent is recommended. Try an inconspicuous spot first before attempting the entire wall. Always rinse the wall well after applying a detergent.

Vinyl wallcovering has little or no moisture permeability. If the design, construction or maintenance of a building and/or other circumstances allow moisture to accumulate in a wall or wall cavity, wallcovering may act as a vapor barrier, restricting the escape of moisture and increasing the risk of mold growth. Proper design, construction and maintenance practices can prevent moisture accumulation. In all cases, moisture and sources of moisture accumulation must be corrected before installing any wallcovering.

Content:
Fabric backed Vinyl
Fire Rating: Class A
Flame Spread: 15
Smoke Developed: 40"


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## Builder Bob (Jul 30, 2018)

bet it stains badly......other than that, it appears to meet all criteria for interior finishes and with a nonabsorbent vinyl backing it meets the criteria listed in the code.

The fabric on front is an additional finishes that is placed on top of what is required by code...........


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## mark handler (Jul 30, 2018)

Urine Resistant?


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## rktect 1 (Jul 30, 2018)

Not a chance.


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## my250r11 (Jul 30, 2018)

No. Do not like the fabric. Fabric is absorbent, not smooth or hard either. IMHO the code wants something that is easy to maintain and clean in the areas due to germs, smells, and bodily fluids that get on them.


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## fatboy (Jul 30, 2018)

I would not be good with it, do not think it meets the intent.


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## JBI (Jul 30, 2018)

I think several responses are missing the point that the fabric is the backing, not the facing material...
I don't think it's a good idea, nor do I believe it meets the 'smooth, hard' language.
BUT... the facing that is exposed would be 'non-absorbent'.


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## Francis Vineyard (Jul 30, 2018)

JBI said:


> I think several responses are missing the point that the fabric is the backing, not the facing material...
> I don't think it's a good idea, nor do I believe it meets the 'smooth, hard' language.
> BUT... the facing that is exposed would be 'non-absorbent'.


Correct, it's a textured vinyl surface that one would typically experience in hotel corridors and rooms.

I mentioned CMU walls because they have been approved, though painted the pits, dimples, crevices and grooves from grout remain and as with the textured vinyl may require a brush to clean thoroughly. Honestly I don't know at what point CMU walls are judged acceptable in these areas.

Thanks for your opinions and appreciate further comments.


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## steveray (Jul 31, 2018)

I would probably advise the owner that it might be a maintenance issue if I did approve it.....Public bathroom?

Exception: This section does not apply to the following
buildings and spaces:
1. Dwelling units and sleeping units.
2. Toilet rooms that are not accessible to the public and
which have not more than one water closet.


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## steveray (Jul 31, 2018)

You are really talking about a health issue...Ask your local health dept how they feel? If they enforce the cleaning/ maintenance on this building down the road? With enough bleach, everything stays clean...


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## Builder Bob (Jul 31, 2018)

and the colors run...


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## rktect 1 (Jul 31, 2018)

JBI said:


> I think several responses are missing the point that the fabric is the backing, not the facing material...


Not a chance.


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## RLGA (Jul 31, 2018)

"Fabric-backed" means that the vinyl surface is the exposed finish and the fabric backing is used to provide better adhesion to the substrate. I would be hesitant in using such a material in a public restroom mainly in part due to the seams. The seams will provide a path for who-knows-what to get behind the wall covering and spread unseen throughout the fabric backing.


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## steveray (Jul 31, 2018)

Which brings us back to the pockets in the painted block.....Who allows them that would not allow this?


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## RLGA (Jul 31, 2018)

Masonry is allowed when it is coated with a block filler and then with an enamel, urethane, or epoxy coating. The finished surface is a textured finish that is a little bit more textured than FRP panels with a pebble finish. If the interpretation of "smooth" is meant to be a continuous unbroken plane, then even ceramic tile wouldn't qualify. I think in this situation, the intent is that the surface be smooth enough to be cleanable. Masonry with the coatings mentioned above could meet this criteria if the voids are adequately filled with the block filler to minimize the depth of the voids so that they could be cleaned.


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## linnrg (Jul 31, 2018)

I think you are going to see this being requested often.  Patterns can be made to the desire of the designer.  It can be removed and replaced easily enough. We used to see similar material in older homes at the kitchen back splashes (wall paper).

The intent of the code is to have a surface durable enough to be kept clean.  A stud and drywall partition with the fabric could be described as a hard wall.

I have been in plenty of restrooms having all tile walls and floors that smell of well aged p$%#'

Often times the grout line of tile are badly stained, Poly carbonate sheeting has joints too.  Urinal partitions has joints at edges. Painted block while hard  unless heavily coated with thick paint has a very poor performance surface in terms of keeping clean.  Many of those old masonry walls have peeling paint.

I think I would approve it.

by the way you are probably seeing this in patient rooms of hospitals - I know for sure in corridors


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## JPohling (Jul 31, 2018)

None of the designers in my office will use it in this application


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## Francis Vineyard (Aug 1, 2018)

JPohling said:


> None of the designers in my office will use it in this application


JPohling, do you know the reason?


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## JPohling (Aug 15, 2018)

Francis Vineyard said:


> JPohling, do you know the reason?


because it is fabric backed with seams and I do not want the liability


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## ADAguy (Aug 15, 2018)

Francis, are you asking this question as an AHJ or a design professional?


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## Francis Vineyard (Aug 15, 2018)

The manufacturers response is the woven or fabric material, typically a blend of  65/35 Poly/Cotton Blend (type II) found in hospitals and hotels, is laminated on front of the vinyl backing.

They mentioned a number of ways their product is manufactured and installed to help prevent the walls absorbing moisture and also to help them remain cleanable.
1.    The product contains additives to resist mold and other micro-biological growth on the product.
2.    The bottom seam against the 4” base will be sealed with a bead of silicone sealant.
3.    The vertical joints are double-cut, meaning one strip will overlap the next strip, and are not abutted.
4.    The adhesive used to hang the wall covering acts as an additional barrier to moisture, with the seams receiving extra adhesive.

Thank you all for the feedback, very much appreciated.


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## Francis Vineyard (Aug 27, 2018)

Not the project in question, but where I visited a new International Hotel last week I notice it's same material.


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## linnrg (Aug 27, 2018)

looks good to me


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## mark handler (Aug 27, 2018)

Francis Vineyard said:


> Not the project in question, but where I visited a new International Hotel last week I notice it's same material.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


​Toilet paper dispenser, to far away from front of bowl....
Does not look like these is sufficient clearance at front of bowl....
vert grab bar not 39 to 41 inches from back wall...


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## Rick18071 (Aug 28, 2018)

mark handler said:


> Toilet paper dispenser, to far away from front of bowl....
> Does not look like these is sufficient clearance at front of bowl....
> vert grab bar not 39 to 41 inches from back wall...



You must have a very large screen. It is only 5" from the back wall on my laptop screen.


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## Francis Vineyard (Aug 29, 2018)

Rick18071 said:


> You must have a very large screen. It is only 5" from the back wall on my laptop screen.


That's funny!


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