# awning vr/s patio cover



## tbz (Mar 25, 2011)

Okay I know I am on thin water with my posts lately but I have another one for U-ALL to give me a little input on.

When does an awning become a patio cover?

Or should I say, where do you as an inspector draw the line with an awning no longer being an awning and now being a patio cover?

I am for real on this question

All response welcomed and thank you in advance

Tom


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## mjesse (Mar 25, 2011)

Awning - supported only by sidewall of building

Patio cover - supported by posts to patio surface

mj


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## Jobsaver (Mar 25, 2011)

Same as mjesse.


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## fatboy (Mar 25, 2011)

I don't really have a basis, but I consider an awning to be something that is for the most part fabricated off site, then final assembled and installed at the customers property.

Patio cover is fabricated/constructed on site.

JMHO


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## tbz (Mar 25, 2011)

OK how about a picture,

The roof of the house back in FEB, piled up some snow and ice and then slide off and wacked this awning real good.

(3 story to roof above)







I believe this is an awning yes/no?


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## fatboy (Mar 25, 2011)

Awning......


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## rktect 1 (Mar 25, 2011)

Not an awning.  Covered front porch.  Not allowed to encroach front yard setback.

What do the villages definitions say about awnings?

Here is ours.  A roof-like cover, temporary in nature, which projects from the wall of a building.

Your's doesn't meet the definition I have to work with.


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## tbz (Mar 25, 2011)

rk,

The setbacks are met well within the building lot lines.

I don't know how someone can call an awing temporary in nature.

The only reason I brought this up was because of the trellis, the awning was not even resting on the trellis, they are for show, see how far they sit inside the edges.

The trellis did however stop the unit from coming off the wall.

In replacing the awning from the snow damage, we are looking at adding a for lack of a word a header spanning from side to side to support the awning when replaced on top of the trellis, something that was not there before.

Wondering if by doing that does if convert it from awning to patio cover or as RK says covered front porch.

Any additional thoughts


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## fatboy (Mar 25, 2011)

I'd still call it an awning.......so would our Development Code definition.........

_Awning  _shall mean a framed exterior architectural feature, attached to and supported from the wall of a building and/or held up by its own supports, which provides or has the appearance of providing shelter from the elements to pedestrians, vehicles, property or buildings.


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## mtlogcabin (Mar 25, 2011)

2009 IBC

AWNING. An architectural projection that provides weather protection, identity or decoration and is wholly supported by the building to which it is attached. An awning is comprised of a lightweight frame structure over which a covering is attached.


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## mark handler (Mar 25, 2011)

In the definitions I have seen over the years, there is nothing to prevent an awning from having supports that extend to the ground. So yes the picture could be defined as an awning.

And the picture does not show a patio, it is a porch or door landing.


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## FredK (Mar 25, 2011)

We call it a covered porch.  It is an awning.


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## TJacobs (Mar 25, 2011)

_CANOPY. An architectural projection that provides weather protection, identity or decoration and is supported by the building to which it is attached and at the outer end by not less than one stanchion. A canopy is comprised of a rigid structure over which a covering is attached._

What do I win?


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## pwood (Mar 25, 2011)

FredK said:
			
		

> We call it a covered porch. It is an awning.


exactly. we would ask for wind and snow loading verification and setback info if it was commercial. residential no permit per R105.2#9


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## mark handler (Mar 25, 2011)

Can be a CANOPY....

Can be a awning.....

It is not a patio cover.....


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## mtlogcabin (Mar 25, 2011)

Looking at the picture and according to the definitions in the I-Codes it is a canopy not an awning

2009 IRC

R201.3 Terms defined in other codes.

Where terms are not defined in this code such terms shall have meanings ascribed to them as in other code publications of the International Code Council.

CANOPY. A permanent structure or architectural projection of rigid construction over which a covering is attached that provides weather protection, identity or decoration, and shall be structurally independent or supported by attachment to a building on one end and by not less than one stanchion on the outer end.

2009 IBC

AWNING. An architectural projection that provides weather protection, identity or decoration and is wholly supported by the building to which it is attached. An awning is comprised of a lightweight frame structure over which a covering is attached.


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## fatboy (Mar 26, 2011)

Hey! While we are talking about awnings...............the horrible language that is in the 09 IBC, awnings exempt from permits, I put a code change in for the 2012 cycle, which was approved by the correlation committee, to more closely resemble the IRC requirement language. Read the 09 IBC, is that screwy? It will be better in 2012.


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## rktect 1 (Mar 26, 2011)

I don't think it is a matter of what COULD it be but what best defines it.  For me a covered porch or covered entry better defines the picture vs. awning.  I am looking at the whole now.  The material above the posts certainly could be an awning but as used, in the village I work in, it is a covered front porch/entry.  If it is inside the setback lines, no problem, only a problem if in front of the front yard setback.

I once had an argument over a bay window submittal.  I think I posted about this before.  The person wanted to build into the front yard setback a 3 foot "bay window".  This is allowed where I work.  What he really wanted to do was build a cantilevered 3 foot deep by 12-15 foot wide 8 foot tall,1st floor addition, including on the 3 foot side, a door to the exterior.  So "addition" better defined what he wanted and why he could not do it as it was in no way a "bay window".


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## GHRoberts (Mar 26, 2011)

tbz said:
			
		

> The only reason I brought this up was because of the trellis, the awning was not even resting on the trellis, they are for show, see how far they sit inside the edges.The trellis did however stop the unit from coming off the wall.


It appears that the trellis did serve the purpose of supporting the ROOF.

I think the item is a roof. With proper support at the wall there is no need for the trellis unless one is of the belt and suspenders persuasion. But one could also design the item to be supported by a header between the trellis posts. But then one needs some lateral support of the posts.

Overall the item is whatever the designer/builder/homeowner thinks it is.

---

Lots of awnings fail. Lots of roofs fail. This one seems to have done well.


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## brudgers (Mar 26, 2011)

tbz said:
			
		

> Any additional thoughts


Yep, both need to meet exactly the same structural loads - so it doesn't matter what you call it.


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## fatboy (Mar 26, 2011)

"Overall the item is whatever the designer/builder/homeowner thinks it is."

And can justify to the building official/plans examiner what it is. You can't call a 3-story building, a two-story building.

And I agree with brudgers.......wow.


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## brudgers (Mar 26, 2011)

You're learning


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## fatboy (Mar 27, 2011)

And sometimes, sometimes, you can be a funny guy.....................


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## brudgers (Mar 27, 2011)

What do you mean funny, funny how?


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## RJJ (Mar 27, 2011)

YA! When is he funny? I also agree that the O9 code needs some improvement in definitions, etc,etc etc.


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## cboboggs (Mar 28, 2011)

I actually agree with brudgers this time as well. Maybe it is true, the world is coming to an end.


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## Alias (Mar 28, 2011)

I'd call it an awning.


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## NH09 (Mar 28, 2011)

I would say regardless of the terminology (awning, canopy, porch roof) it would need to be capable of resisting the snow/wind loads in your area. The only exceptions we make are for the retractable awnings, which can be rolled up in high wind or snow conditions.


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