# Accessible stall required in private parking lot?



## Robert (Jun 26, 2016)

Hello. I am working on a TI and the existing building has multiple tenants, all open to the public (Supercuts, restaurant, yoga, etc.). There is metered street parking. The onsite parking lot is private, with a sign posted "private parking only", and has 14 spaces reserved with peoples names or business names. There is no accessible stall. According to CA standards, I am to devote 20% of construction cost to ADA upgrades, including parking. Can this private lot not be required to have an accessible stall? Thank you.


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## mark handler (Jun 26, 2016)

No.


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## Robert (Jun 26, 2016)

Thank you. Oddly, there is a 14' wide space with ramp that had the painted accessible symbol blacked out and a reserved placard placed on the wall in front of it. Kind of shocked it has not been challenged.


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## ADAguy (Jun 27, 2016)

MH? This is not an occupiable facility, please justify your response.
I assume there is no attendant and even then, there is no requirement to provide a hut for attended parking lots. 
Robert, upgrade it to code minimum: number of spaces (1) van, freshen stripes, verify tow-away sign info and presence of fine sign.


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## Robert (Jun 27, 2016)

There is no hut, no attendant, just a tow away sign for trespassing. To simplify my question...does a private parking lot require accessible parking? The parking is used by owner and employees of the building...reserved spaces.


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## mtlogcabin (Jun 27, 2016)

Robert said:


> There is no hut, no attendant, just a tow away sign for trespassing. To simplify my question...does a private parking lot require accessible parking? The parking is used by owner and employees of the building...reserved spaces.



Depends, a private lot with assigned spaces for specific individuals does not require an identified handicap parking space. However if the assigned spots are for a customer of a specific business to be used then yes an accessible space must be provided for the customers of the various businesses.  

A private lot where customers rent specific spaces is not a public lot requiring accessible space. However if the future a renter of the lot does need a handicap parking space then one will have to be provided.

In other words the lot should be designed to include one in the future if needed. 

Then again you are in California 

*You Live in California when...*

You make over $250,000, and you still can't afford to buy a house.
The high school quarterback calls a time-out to answer his cell phone.
The fastest part of your commute is going down your driveway.
You know how to eat an artichoke.
You drive your rented Mercedes to your neighborhood block party.
When someone asks you how far something is, you tell them how long it will take to get there rather than how many miles away it is.


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## Robert (Jun 27, 2016)

so true especially the last! Thanks.


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## mark handler (Jun 28, 2016)

ADAguy said:


> MH? This is not an occupiable facility,


Read the original post:


> .....existing building has multiple tenants, all open to the public (Supercuts, restaurant, yoga, etc.).


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## cda (Jun 28, 2016)

Still trying to figure out what an "accessible stall" in a parking lot looks like?

Are there grab bars

Are there roll over vehicle stops

etc.


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## mark handler (Jun 28, 2016)

cda said:


> Still trying to figure out what an "accessible stall" in a parking lot looks like?


*Seriously?*


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## mark handler (Jun 28, 2016)

mark handler said:


> *Seriously?*


*You need to share whatever you are on.....*


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## cda (Jun 28, 2016)

When I put accessiable stall in image search

It comes up with


http://acs7.cortland.edu/irrc/Pictures.asp?pAgencyID=25

Maybe stall is one of those English terms for parking space


Oh


http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Parking stall


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## ADAguy (Jun 28, 2016)

Nice "non-compliant" example Mark.


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## mtlogcabin (Jun 28, 2016)

What makes it non compliant


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## mark handler (Jun 28, 2016)

ADAguy said:


> Nice "non-compliant" example Mark.


"Non-compliant" in CA
CDA is not in CA. Other than what you may think, the world does not comply to CA codes.


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## ADAguy (Jun 29, 2016)

CDA isn't but question author is (smiling), so your example is CA non-compliant on certain elements.


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## mark handler (Jun 29, 2016)

ADAguy said:


> CDA isn't but question author is (smiling), so your example is CA non-compliant on certain elements.


It is ADA and ANSI 117  compliant
And posted based on specific posting not original posting.


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## ADAguy (Jun 29, 2016)

MH, I see no "No Parking in 12" letters, no $250 fine sign and no TD's.


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## ADAguy (Jun 29, 2016)

Ok Einstein, I only "see" with CA eyes, as to ADA, yes, it differs from us.


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## mark handler (Jun 29, 2016)

ADAguy said:


> MH, I see no "No Parking in 12" letters, no $250 fine sign and no TD's.


No required outside CA


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## Timo (Jun 30, 2016)

Not sure what CA code requires, but ICC and ADA clearly call for accessible parking spaces in EACH parking facility.  (2012 IBC, 1106.1; 2010 ADAAG, 208.2)  Sometimes, if the official allows, you might be able to count all parking on a property as one 'facility,' but I doubt you can count public on-street parking against a private facility, and the "private" designation marks this clearly as a 'separate facility' anyway.  Marking spaces as "private" and putting tenant names on them doesn't overrule building code or the ADA.  What happens when they get a disabled employee or tenant?  It's all about equal treatment.  Are you going to tell that tenant he has to park on street or in public lot when his equals get private stalls?


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## Builder Bob (Jun 30, 2016)

I do not see an exemption in the building code for "private" parking. It basically states if you have X number of parking spaces, then Y number of parking spaces are required to be accessible.

*1106.1 Required. *
Where parking is provided, _accessible _parking spaces shall be provided in compliance with Table 1106.1, except as required by Sections 1106.2 through 1106.4. Where more than one parking facility is provided on a _site_, the number of parking spaces required to be _accessible _shall be calculated separately for each parking facility. 

The equal opportunity is the intent of accessibility but usually ends up being attorney driven for resolution -

We do not enforce ADA - which has exemption for private or non-profit entities.....

Our state enforces the ICC codes and as of tomorrow we start enforcing the IEBC as well.


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## mtlogcabin (Jun 30, 2016)

I view a private parking lot as similar to self storage unit. The individual rents the space. As an owner of the storage unit I have to provide an accessible unit in the design but I can rent the unit to anyone after all the other units are leased. If someone comes in after they are all leased requesting an accessible unit I do not have to evict the current tenant to make the accessible unit available to the individual requesting an accessible unit. 

However if an existing tenant of a leased parking space needs an accessible space then the design of the parking lot should be able to provide the reasonable accommodation similar to a "B" unit in a residential occupancy.


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## Robert (Jul 1, 2016)

This has been an interesting post and I don't know the answer. Private parking for a public building. The legal van accessible space is there, but no HC signage (just a "reserved for" sign) and the painted HC logo has been blacked out. Perhaps at one point, a tenant needed the accessible space, then the lease ended, moved out and the new tenant moves in, who does not need the accessible space (*and* no other tenant needs it), but still needs a space. Hence the blackout of the space. If the HC logo and signage stayed in place, and this new tenant uses it, would that raise eyebrows even more than decommissioning the space?


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## mtlogcabin (Jul 1, 2016)

http://nwadacenter.org/factsheet/ac...yment-accommodation-practical-guide-employers


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