# Playground  Areas



## globe trekker (Mar 3, 2010)

I have a proposed completely fenced in play area, with a ' play structure ' to be constructed.      There is one gate and

one double gate shown in this proposed play area.   It is associated with an exisiting church.   Total square feet of the

play area is unknown at this time.     The chain link fencing wil be approx. 4 ft. in height.    I do not know the ages or

quantity of persons that wil be utilizing it, as of now.

My *QUESTION*  is, how would you classify this area?    It is totally open  [ meaning that there are no walls and no roof  ].

A-5,  I-4,  E,  a combination,  accessory use  or  U ? I will know more about the ages and quantity after a preliminary

meeting later this week.

The playground equipment I can see as a " U ",  but the whole [ fenced in ] playground area is what I am seeking.    I AM

aware of the egress requirements in Sect. 1024.6 and having the playground equipment itself meet the frost line depth

requirements of Section 1805.2.1 [ in the `06 IBC  ].

Your thoughts please!   Yes, even the Negative Nannies on here are requested to provide input.    

Thanks ya'll !!

.


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## mtlogcabin (Mar 3, 2010)

Re: Playground  Areas

This Negative Nanny may and I emphasize may require a foundation permit only due to the frost depth. Other than that I  would not touch a piece of playground equipment.



> My QUESTION is, how would you classify this area?


You don't. You classify buildings and structures

301.1 Scope.

The provisions of this chapter shall control the classification of all buildings and structures as to use and occupancy.


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## cda (Mar 3, 2010)

Re: Playground  Areas

U   if anything, just to not call it a rope challange area!!!

Is the fenced in area connected to a building in anyway?????


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## Gene Boecker (Mar 3, 2010)

Re: Playground  Areas

You might want frost depth designs for the fencing too.  Otherwise. . . . .

The "rest is up to U."


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## Coug Dad (Mar 3, 2010)

Re: Playground  Areas

ASTM F1487 Standard Consumer Safety Performance Specification for Playground Equipment for Public Use is a voluntary standard that has not been adopted in IBC Chapter 35.  You could request that it be used as a guide for the installation.


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## brudgers (Mar 3, 2010)

Re: Playground  Areas

You're over thinking this situation and over applying the code.

So heck, go for H1.


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## Coug Dad (Mar 3, 2010)

Re: Playground  Areas

Here is a Handbook from CPSC that might give the *owner* some guidance.  I am not sure how much a code enforcer can actually ask for.

http://www.cpsc.gov/cpscpub/pubs/325.pdf


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## globe trekker (Mar 3, 2010)

Re: Playground  Areas

I am not so concerned about the playground equipment itself.   I AM aware of the ' _guidelines only_ ' for the playground

equipment, so I can recommend those guidelines that Coug Dad provided a link to.

cda,

The chain link type fencing will be around the rear of the church building, right up next to the rear egress door / landing /

steps, but not connected directly to the building itself.

Maybe I am asking the question in the wrong way. *SCENARIO:*   You will have xx number of kids and supervision in a

completely exterior, fenced in location without walls or a roof.   The fencing will be approx. 4 ft. in height with two separate

gates on opposite sides of the play area.    Within this play area there will be a playground structure with a soft mulched

area approx. 300 sq. ft. in size.

How would you classify this fenced in area?  Egress requirements?  Other?

.


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## globe trekker (Mar 3, 2010)

Re: Playground  Areas

FWIW, I received some more info on the ' playground project '.    The fenced area butts up to the rear egress door in

the Educational building / wing of the church.     When persons exit this rear egress door, steps lead down to grade

level and into the completely fenced in area.   They WOULD have to exit from the fenced in area to move towards the '

public way '.        A fourth gate is also planned.     The total playground area measures approx. 2,900 sq. ft.

Thanks for your input!    

.


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## mtlogcabin (Mar 3, 2010)

Re: Playground  Areas

Now the exit from the church into this fenced area needs to comply with Exceptions in1024.6

1024.6 Access to a public way.

The exit discharge shall provide a direct and unobstructed access to a public way.

Exception: Where access to a public way cannot be provided, a safe dispersal area shall be provided where all of the following are met:

1.	The area shall be of a size to accommodate at least 5 square feet (0.28 m2) for each person.

2.	The area shall be located on the same lot at least 50 feet (15 240 mm) away from the building requiring egress.

3.	The area shall be permanently maintained and identified as a safe dispersal area.

4.	The area shall be provided with a safe and unobstructed path of travel from the building.


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## rktect 1 (Mar 3, 2010)

Re: Playground  Areas

Just told someone today that we do not require a permit for playground equipment.

And that is true until someone decides it becomes a great big theme park or waterpark etc.  But playground equipment = no permit.


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## globe trekker (Mar 3, 2010)

Re: Playground  Areas

Because the proposed fencing butts up [ directly ] to the rear egress door of the Ed. wing, could I classify the

playground area as an extension of the Educational wing, hence the egress requirements ?    The church owners

ARE going to be asking what the AHJ position is on this planned project.

rktect 1,

Agreed, ...the playground equipment by itself would not require a permit or inspections.

.


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## cda (Mar 3, 2010)

Re: Playground  Areas

I would not classify it or make it  a "U"

My concern was is the building exiting through this area, and if so, sounds like need panic harware on the gates

also, not an IBC person, but do you need a concrete walkway form the building out through the fenced in area, thorugh the gates,  to out side the fenced in area??????????


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## MarkRandall (Mar 3, 2010)

Re: Playground  Areas

There is no occupancy for a playground area. Take care of folks exiting the building through the playground area. You may want to check accessibility of the play area. I don't recall if accessibility is covered in IBC/ANSI or just ADA, but it should be accessible.


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## Coug Dad (Mar 3, 2010)

Re: Playground  Areas

I have typically configured the egress from the bulding to not pass through the playground enclosure.  That way, the gate(s) from the playground can be provided with latches high so that staff can reach them, but the crumb crunchers cannot escape.  The gates are also locked from the outside and protected in daycare uses to prevent children being picked up by unauthorized persons.  The playground requires two exits when the occupant load exceeds 50 persons based upon 50 square feet per person.  IBC (2006) Section 1004.8


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## mtlogcabin (Mar 3, 2010)

Re: Playground  Areas

Agree with cda if the fenced in area does not meet the exceptions for a Safe Dispersal Area under 1024.6 then panic hardware would be need on the exits. You might get objections from the church because a child could just exit the play area un-noticed. I would give them the option of panic hardware on the gates or make the area comply with the Safe Dispersal Area requirements if there is room. Extra fencing is cheaper than panic hardware.

Or what Coug Dad Said


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## globe trekker (Mar 4, 2010)

Re: Playground  Areas

Much thanks to you all for your input!         There is some great information that is very relevant to this project.

Ya'll are the best!

.


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