# Elevation of ignition source



## Keystone (Feb 8, 2012)

2009 IRC M1307.3 Elevation of ignition source. Appliances having an ignition source shall be elevated such that the source of ignition is not less than 18 inches (457 mm) above the floor in garages. For the purpose of this section, rooms or spaces that are not part of the living space of a dwelling unit and that communicate with a private garage through openings shall be considered to be part of the garage.

Is this requirement based more on the fact of liquid gas protection, vapors, or other?


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## Frank (Feb 8, 2012)

Vapors from spilled gasoline


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## mtlogcabin (Feb 8, 2012)

Frank said:
			
		

> Vapors from spilled gasoline


Or open container


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## Builder Bob (Feb 8, 2012)

or from a pilot light or electronic ignition not lit or firing....


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## klarenbeek (Feb 8, 2012)

Definetly gasoline vapors.  We had a house fire in a four year old house here. The owner had put a chest type freezer in the garage.  Gasoline leaked out of a lawn mower, and when the compressor for the freezer kicked in, the garage turned into a fireball.  Fortunately the teenager that was home got out safely, but the house was a total loss. They just finished rebuilding the new house on the old foundation this past summer.


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## Keystone (Feb 8, 2012)

Now to my next question, if the appliances are below the garage level in a crawl space but the access to the crawlspace is through a garage with a raised platform over 18" having a hatch door placed would you allow?


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## mtlogcabin (Feb 8, 2012)

Some vapors are heavier than air (LPG) some are lighter. How will you seal between the garage and crawlspace for vapors getting under the sill plates or throug a crack.

305.3 Elevation of ignition source.

Equipment and appliances having an ignition source shall be elevated such that the source of ignition is not less than 18 inches (457 mm) above the floor in hazardous locations and public garages, private garages, repair garages, motor fuel-dispensing facilities and parking garages. For the purpose of this section, rooms or spaces that are not part of the living space of a dwelling unit and that communicate directly with a private garage through openings shall be considered to be part of the private garage.

I believe you could hang your hat on this if they are fuel fired appliances


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## Keystone (Feb 8, 2012)

mtlogcabin - agreed, re-enforcing my views or correcting them as needed prior to the issuance of the correction notice to the renowned builder.


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## cda (Feb 9, 2012)

since I do not have to enforce this section, I will ask the stupid question

In this set up with a basement below the garage, and with an opening from the garage to the basement

do any ignition sources in the basement only have to be 18 inches above the basement floor

Or

does the code look at the basement filling above the 18 inch mark and and igniton source being above the 18 inches lighting of the vapors??

or

does the igtition source only have to be 18 inches above the basement floor and take the chance of vapors getting above that level


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## pwood (Feb 9, 2012)

cda,

   some jurisdictions require weatherstripped self- closing doors in this situation.the basement needs seperation from the garage if living space above, or the basement needs seperation from the house.


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## Gregg Harris (Feb 9, 2012)

It is hard to picture exactly what the scenario is but it sounds as if the access to the crawl space is through the garage and in the crawl space is where the equipment will be located and would make the crawl space a continuation of the garage requiring the 18 inch minimum clearance for the appliances. I can not picture the explanation of the "18" platform and hatch door".

Is the garage slab and the crawl space at the same level, and how deep is the crawl space?

IMC  306.4 and IFGC 306.4  should come into play


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## cda (Feb 9, 2012)

Ok reread it thought you could acess an occupiable basement through the garage

Never mind

Remember the Alamo


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## north star (Feb 9, 2012)

*= = =*





> "IMC 306.4 and IFGC 306.4 should come into play"


Wouldn't the applicable Residential codes be used vs. the Commercial codes[ RE: Section M1305, ...`06 IRC ]?.....Not sure of how " Keystone' " adopted

codes are administered.

*= = =*


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## Keystone (Feb 9, 2012)

north star - Pa. 2009IRC,IBC,IMC,IPC,IECC - no adoptions or amendments that I can think of would differ from text of code as written.

The scenario I am questioning is residential based.


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## Keystone (Feb 9, 2012)

pwood - I was just confronted with that scenario of requesting to weather strip the hatch door. At this point my view is, if the builder can produce an interpretation from ICC saying weather stripping is satisfactory then I can accept.


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## Keystone (Feb 9, 2012)

Gregg Harris - the garage slab is elevated above the crawlspace by an estimated 2'. Then the house floor is elevated 1.25' above the garage floor. In a nutshell, the home is a raised ranch.


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## righter101 (Feb 9, 2012)

The remainder of IRC M1307.3 "ELEVATION OF IGNITION SOURCE", states,

For the purpose of this section, rooms or spaces that are not part

of the living space of a dwelling unit and that communicate

with a private garage through openings shall be considered to

be part of the garage.

18" above the floor level in the garage would be reasonable.  that may be a higher mark in the scenario that you propose, but I think the IRC makes the intent clear.


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## pwood (Feb 9, 2012)

Keystone said:
			
		

> pwood - I was just confronted with that scenario of requesting to weather strip the hatch door. At this point my view is, if the builder can produce an interpretation from ICC saying weather stripping is satisfactory then I can accept.


 the door from the house to the garage is weatherstripped to meet energy codes and prohibit gas fumes from entering! What's different here?


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## Keystone (Feb 9, 2012)

pwood - practically speaking I don't think there would be a difference but ICC code and commentary specifically calls out direct access from garage to crawlspace and only differentiates acceptance when it concerns habitable space


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## Gregg Harris (Feb 9, 2012)

pwood said:
			
		

> the door from the house to the garage is weatherstripped to meet energy codes and prohibit gas fumes from entering! What's different here?


Door to crawl space could inadvertently be left open but main door to living space would probably be noticed and closed.


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## pwood (Feb 10, 2012)

Gregg Harris said:
			
		

> Door to crawl space could inadvertently be left open but main door to living space would probably be noticed and closed.


 post#10 = self-closing!


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## Gregg Harris (Feb 10, 2012)

pwood said:
			
		

> post#10 = self-closing!


Even worse, if I where to enter a crawl space that had self closing doors or hatch I would find a way to prop or fasten it open and could easily forget to go back and close when done servicing.


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## klarenbeek (Feb 13, 2012)

Remember that the appliance needs to be in the living space in order not to be elevated.  IRC defines living space as space within a dwelling unit utilized for living, sleeping, eating, cooking, bathing, washing, and sanitation purposes.  I don't know of any crawlspace used for these purposes.  Doesn't matter if the door is self closing or gasketed, the appliance is not in the living space so needs to be elevated 18".


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## klarenbeek (Feb 13, 2012)

Also, this doesn't apply just to fuel fired appliances.  Anything that sparks is a source of ignition: contactors, motors, ect. can also ignite gasoline fumes.  Those items would also need to be elevated 18".


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## pwood (Feb 13, 2012)

klarenbeek said:
			
		

> Also, this doesn't apply just to fuel fired appliances. Anything that sparks is a source of ignition: contactors, motors, ect. can also ignite gasoline fumes. Those items would also need to be elevated 18".


 would you require receptacles to be 18+" above the floor?


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## klarenbeek (Feb 13, 2012)

pwood said:
			
		

> would you require receptacles to be 18+" above the floor?


Sorry, no. I should have said anything within the appliance that can spark.  The code section is specific to appliances only, so this section does not include outlets. (BTW, I should qualify this with the fact that I only cover mechanical inspections. Inspectors in our jurisdiction are trade specific.)


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## Mac (Feb 13, 2012)

Here's one I have heard a couple of times - "Does just the ignition source or the whole appliance need to be elevated 18 inches?"


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## klarenbeek (Feb 13, 2012)

The code section just says "source of ignition" so I take that to mean only whatever can ignite fumes. The bottom of the cabinet housing could be below 18" as long as any motors and contacts are up 18".


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