# For all you fans of sprinklering one and two family dwelling



## brudgers (Feb 11, 2010)

So are you going to allow home owner's to do it themselves?


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## fatboy (Feb 11, 2010)

Re: For all you fans of sprinklering one and two family dwelling

Not neccesarilly a "fan", but yes, in CO homeowners are allowed to perform any plumbing and electrical work on their primary residence. So, installing a system in compliance with P2904 wiould be allowed.


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## FyrBldgGuy (Feb 11, 2010)

Re: For all you fans of sprinklering one and two family dwelling

Would you allow a homeowner to replace a toilet? Hmm?

Lets see a toilet is a plumbing fixture that has a self contained P-trap to exclude sewer gas from entering the living space.  If the wax ring is not set properly then sewer gas can enter the home.

Some home owners have even been known to replace a smoke detector.  Now that is a 110 volt device with safety implications.

We need to make sure that all home owners who could potentially work on thier homes have at least 8000 hours of training.  We could place the requirements in the real estate laws.  So before you can apply for a home loan the prospective buyer would have to show proof of training.

Future Real Estate Disclosure

"Notice! This property was previously owned by an individual who may have altered plumbing, electrical, fire alarm systems, doors, egress windows and other safety features.  The previous owner has not completed the minimum of 8000 hours of training required for working on safety systems.  The property is listed in an AS IS condition."


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## Builder Bob (Feb 11, 2010)

Re: For all you fans of sprinklering one and two family dwelling

Just for grins and giggles, we let plumber joe install the system. He has been a professional plumber since 1975. In our state, contractors are not required to have continuing education credits....they just have to pass a qualifying test when they start being a contractor. Also, A residential contractor license in our state is good for all trades----- I might have had mine since 1977..


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## Mule (Feb 11, 2010)

Re: For all you fans of sprinklering one and two family dwelling



			
				FyrBldgGuy said:
			
		

> Would you allow a homeowner to replace a toilet? Hmm?Lets see a toilet is a plumbing fixture that has a self contained P-trap to exclude sewer gas from entering the living space.  If the wax ring is not set properly then sewer gas can enter the home.


In Texas a homeowner who has their residence homesteaded can perform all of their plumbing and electrical work. They are required to secure permits and call for inspections to make sure they comply with the coses though.


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## Uncle Bob (Feb 11, 2010)

Re: For all you fans of sprinklering one and two family dwelling

I am not aware of any State that prohibits a homeowner from building, remodeling, and/or repairing his/her home.

Surely they are more qualified than the illegal aliens that are going to be installing residential sprinkler systems; even after there is a requirement for an installer to be "licensed" to contract the work.  Most Americans who own homes can at least, read the instructions.

Uncle Bob


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## JBI (Feb 11, 2010)

Re: For all you fans of sprinklering one and two family dwelling

U B - LMAO! Yeah, they CAN read directions, but how many actually DO read them?


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## Mule (Feb 11, 2010)

Re: For all you fans of sprinklering one and two family dwellingCode Violations??????

View attachment 65


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## pwood (Feb 11, 2010)

Re: For all you fans of sprinklering one and two family dwelling

if the state allows the homeowner to install them,then i would have to. all the system is is a pvc outside lawn  sprinkler system with some glorified sprinkler heads installed in the attic instead. so what's all the hype about? :mrgreen:


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## RJJ (Feb 11, 2010)

Re: For all you fans of sprinklering one and two family dwelling

No hype here!  :mrgreen:


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## FM William Burns (Feb 11, 2010)

Re: For all you fans of sprinklering one and two family dwelling

Ahhhhhhhhhh...........thus the INTENT comes back to play.  This is the intent of P2904 and it's reference to Chapter 29 and design tables.  The IRC is intended or its motive is to be a stand alone document so the dwelling and its systems can be a DIY dream


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## RJJ (Feb 12, 2010)

Re: For all you fans of sprinklering one and two family dwelling

YA! Although I hate having to deal with Harry home owner with his Saturday afternoon project, it is part of the job. They have  the right to do the work themselves. I can deal with that right. It is a burden with all the questions and very often I say get professional help. Fact still remains it is a right and should not be taken away even for sprinklers.


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## FM William Burns (Feb 12, 2010)

Re: For all you fans of sprinklering one and two family dwelling

I agree and thus the importance of having knowlegable inspection officials qualified to review and inspect residential sprinkler systems before the dwellers move in so study up everyone because eventually they will be here to stay once the state battles are over and more jurisdictions finally adopt the provisions.


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## brudgers (Feb 12, 2010)

Re: For all you fans of sprinklering one and two family dwelling

Homeowners building new houses aren't probably going to be as much of an issue as homeowner's building additions or making alterations.

I suspect that do it yourselfers will treat residential sprinklers like gearheads treat catalytic converters.


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## pwood (Feb 12, 2010)

Re: For all you fans of sprinklering one and two family dwelling



			
				FM William Burns said:
			
		

> I agree and thus the importance of having knowlegable inspection officials qualified to review and inspect residential sprinkler systems before the dwellers move in so study up everyone because eventually they will be here to stay once the state battles are over and more jurisdictions finally adopt the provisions.


ahh yes!  unfunded state mandates driven by the  lobbying skills and payola of special interest groups! cha-ching for all except the ahj who may need training dollars and gets none. this will be swell in these lean times :mrgreen:  oh i'm sorry bubba but your fire sprinkler system will cost 20,000 for the storage tanks, pressure ***** pumps, and system install. oh you say you will bringing in your potable water in 50 gallon drums and don't have a well?(legal in calif). just have an engineer design your system and submit the plans to me. my brother cletus is a sanitation  engineer can he do it? sure no problem! there will be moments!


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## brudgers (Feb 12, 2010)

Re: For all you fans of sprinklering one and two family dwelling

Yep, the IBC didn't want good spinkler code.

Just get it out the door and will make cosmetic fixes later...1975 Detroit mentality.

The IRC is the Chevy Vega of Building codes...with apologies to GM.


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## pwood (Feb 12, 2010)

Re: For all you fans of sprinklering one and two family dwelling



			
				brudgers said:
			
		

> Yep, the IBC didn't want good spinkler code.Just get it out the door and will make cosmetic fixes later...1975 Detroit mentality.
> 
> The IRC is the Chevy Vega of Building codes...with apologies to GM.


spinkler or sphincter code? :mrgreen:


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## fatboy (Feb 12, 2010)

Re: For all you fans of sprinklering one and two family dwelling

brudger, you're right, the codes, none of them, are perfect.

So, are you proposing any changes? Involved with any groups proposing changes?

Or is it easier to sit in the back and bitch about them?????????

Just saying, kind of like complaining about politics, when you haven't bothered to go out and vote.  :roll:


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## brudgers (Feb 12, 2010)

Re: For all you fans of sprinklering one and two family dwelling



			
				fatboy said:
			
		

> brudger, you're right, the codes, none of them, are perfect.So, are you proposing any changes? Involved with any groups proposing changes?
> 
> Or is it easier to sit in the back and bitch about them?????????
> 
> Just saying, kind of like complaining about politics, when you haven't bothered to go out and vote.  :roll:


Of course it's easier to bitch about them.

But that doesn't mean participating in a bad process will improve anything, any more than calling in to Rush's show will change his editorial position.


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## Mule (Feb 12, 2010)

Re: For all you fans of sprinklering one and two family dwelling

brudgers, Why are you so against a homeowner performing his own work? If the homeowner feels he is qualified and submits the appropriate documentation, secures the correct permits and gets the necessary inspections, then what's so bad about that?


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## pwood (Feb 12, 2010)

Re: For all you fans of sprinklering one and two family dwelling

mule,

  he is a man with a pencil who draws! i think he is paranoid that homeowners wil invade his domain next!


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## brudgers (Feb 12, 2010)

Re: For all you fans of sprinklering one and two family dwelling



			
				Mule said:
			
		

> brudgers, Why are you so against a homeowner performing his own work? If the homeowner feels he is qualified and submits the appropriate documentation, secures the correct permits and gets the necessary inspections, then what's so bad about that?


I'm not against homeowners performing work.

I'm pointing out how bad p2904 is as public policy...it's like letting Peta tree huggers on crack and steroids write environmental policy.

Forget that it will do almost nothing to reduce residential fire deaths given the volume of existing housing stock and the likely pace of new construction of sfr's based on both projected demand and a greying demographic.

The implementation is bad.  Is a manual for the Owner really going to protect anyone?  Is a "mattress tag" really going to save a life?  And of course the undefined "fire protection specialist" now there's a good way to make sure that the public is protected...even my dog is fully qualified.


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