# Lonely lori



## cda (Apr 13, 2012)

Only 8000 people visit her a month, please if you have not gone to her site pay her a visit::::

http://idighardware.com/

"""I would love to reach 10,000 visits per month, but I need your help.  If you have coworkers or industry pals who might find iDigHardware helpful, please drop them an email and invite them to visit.  For all of my Ingersoll Rand compañeros, and anyone else who does training and would like to share the site as a resource, there are now postcards with the website information available. """""

http://idighardware.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/iDigHardware-Postcard.jpg


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## Coug Dad (Apr 13, 2012)

I just subscribed to her free site.  There are some interesting discussions that cross over into building code issues.  Better and more thorough code discussion on this board.


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## fatboy (Apr 13, 2012)

I ended up on her site through a google search. Question was asked of me regarding what the max undercut can be on a "fire" door. There was a great blog from her on there, answered the question perfectly.


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## gbhammer (Apr 13, 2012)

I agree Lori is great and we all should help spread the word about her site.


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## north star (Apr 13, 2012)

*= >*

I'll start this party off...

Ya'll please visit "Door Guru

Lori's" website......C`mon,

help the nice lady out!



*http://idighardware.com/*

*< =*


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## fireguy (Apr 13, 2012)

I needed fire door inspection forms.  She sent some and a handy guide about doors.  My customer was impressed with my vast knowledge of fire doors.  I smiled and said Thank You.

She knows of that which she speaks.


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## LGreene (Apr 15, 2012)

Awww....THANK YOU!!!  This site is #2 in referrals to my blog, with Google being #1.  I appreciate all of your help, and yes Coug Dad, this site has better and more thorough code discussion but if you ever need anything pertaining to doors or hardware, you know where to find me.  ;-)


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## conarb (Apr 15, 2012)

Lori:

I have a question now, what is the highest quality automatic door bottom for exterior doors?  I've used Pemko for many years but have never been that satisfied with them, they will be morticed into 2¼" doors, but if necessary I could have the doors built thicker.  I've even looked at English products but haven't called yet, I am building in our Wildlands-Urban Interface zone, so want the best for both fire-protection and air-sealing.  I cannot use a raised threshold.


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## cda (Apr 16, 2012)

oh no Lori found out we were talking about her!!!!!


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## fireguy (Apr 16, 2012)

conarb said:
			
		

> Lori:I have a question now, what is the highest quality automatic door bottom for exterior doors? .


good question, I don't know.  All I know is Ingersol Rand will talk to you if you have problems with thier products, no matter the age.  They have rebuilt closers for me in the past.


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## Doorman (Apr 16, 2012)

Well, Pemko is not part of the IR group, it is part of the Assa/Abloy group.

As long as I'm here, I'll respond to conarb: Auto door bottoms are generally contra-indicated at high use doors, creating a maintenance headache.  You indicate no threshold... what is the floor condition?  If there is no elevated smooth surface for the door bottom to rub against, the life of the seal will be very short.  If a mortised door bottom, its replacement requires the door be removed.

As far a manufacturer, if a similar product from any manufacturer is specified you should get similar results.  Pemko, Reese, and National Guard are a few common manufacturers.

Rebuilt door closers are another misunderstood area.  Yes they can be rebuilt, but this is usually done only when a simple replacement is impractical.  Watch out for fire rated doors... was the closer rebuild actually done at an approved facility?


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## conarb (Apr 16, 2012)

Doorman:

Interior floors are honed lava stone flowing out to a terrace with flamed lava stone, I will transition with a polished stone threshold with a ¼" rise, hinges will be Rixson.


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## Doorman (Apr 16, 2012)

_"... I will transition with a polished stone threshold with a ¼" rise..."_

The most common use of auto door bottoms is with the sponge neoprene insert.  As long as the sweeping motion of the ADB is over a smooth surface, that will help longevity.  An irregular or carpeted surface will tear the rubber up, or simply tear it out of the frame.

I am presuming you are using a Pemko 434_RL.  The model 434_NBL is less fussy about the floor condition, but is not as good a sound limiter.

Rixson hinges, or offset pivots?  How will pivots work with an ADB?


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## conarb (Apr 16, 2012)

Doorman said:
			
		

> Rixson hinges, or offset pivots?  How will pivots work with an ADB?


I don't know, I may have to give up on the Rixsons, this is California and the primary concern is indoor-outdoor living that flows without tripping over a threshold, clean design without protruding hardware is secondary.  I guess I better call the Rixson representative, thanks for pointing out the potential conflict.


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## Doorman (Apr 16, 2012)

conarb, my question regarding the use of pivots and mortised auto door bottom together is rhetorical.  That pesky rule about two things occupying the same space at the same time will come into play.

If the door is heavy then pivots is most likely the proper selection.  With pivots the majority of the axial load is borne by the floor system instead of the frame.

I'm sort of taking up Lori's oxygen here.  Perhaps another thread can be started and this sort of thing can be discussed there.  So, if you will excuse me, I am going to go Dig some Hardware.


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## LGreene (Apr 16, 2012)

conarb said:
			
		

> I have a question now, what is the highest quality automatic door bottom for exterior doors?  I've used Pemko for many years but have never been that satisfied with them, they will be morticed into 2¼" doors, but if necessary I could have the doors built thicker.  I've even looked at English products but haven't called yet, I am building in our Wildlands-Urban Interface zone, so want the best for both fire-protection and air-sealing.  I cannot use a raised threshold.


As Doorman said, I wouldn't specify an auto door bottom for an exterior door because they don't hold up well over time.  I would just use a sweep but the sweep should have a raised threshold to seal against.

Doorman - Thanks for covering for me while I was traveling to Florida.  Don't ever worry about taking up my oxygen.


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## conarb (Apr 17, 2012)

Lori & Doorman:

Code only allows ½", ADA only allows ¼", everybody building a modern home in California wants an uninterrupted flow from inside to outside and vise-versa, in addition the door has to be far enough off the floor to clear at least ½" for oriental area rugs in the entry, this wasn't a problem until air-sealing entered the codes, there has to be a way.  I'll call Rixson but I'll probably have to make do with high quality butt hinges and a Pemko auto door bottom.


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## cda (Apr 17, 2012)

330 views of this thread

Hope you have visited Lori's site

http://idighardware.com/


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## Doorman (Apr 17, 2012)

conarb, you said "_Code only allows ½", ADA only allows ¼"..._"

All the documentation I have indicates a 1/2" overall height threshold complies with ADA.  No?


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## conarb (Apr 17, 2012)

Doorman:I don't know, better ask Mark our ADA expert, I'm old and have always used my 1197 UBC Handbook, they show ¼" for ADA, maybe ti's changed?

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## mark handler (Apr 17, 2012)

conarb said:
			
		

> ...1197 UBC Handbook


I knew you were old But I had no idea


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## mark handler (Apr 17, 2012)

Are you posting about a Single family? Multi Family? Office? Mercantile?

I agree with Lori Automatic Door bottoms on exterior doors. They dont last.

Surface mounted ones also do not meet ADA


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## mark handler (Apr 17, 2012)

conarb said:
			
		

> Lori & Doorman:Code only allows ½", ADA only allows ¼"


2010 ADASAD 404.2.5 Thresholds. Thresholds, if provided at doorways, shall be 1/2 inch (13 mm) high maximum. Raised thresholds and changes in level at doorways shall comply with 302 and 303.

 EXCEPTION: Existing or altered thresholds 3/4 inch (19 mm) high maximum that have a beveled edge on each side with a slope not steeper than 1:2 shall not be required to comply with 404.2.5.

2010 CALIFORNIA BUILDING CODE

1133B.2.4 Floor level at doors. Regardless of the occupant load, there shall be aflooror landing on each side ofa door.

1133B.2.4.1 Thresholds. The floor or landing shall not be more than 1/2 inch (12.7 mm) lower than the threshold of the doorway. Change in level between 1/4 inch (6 mm) and 1/2 inch (12.7 mm) shall be beveled with a slope no greater than one unit vertical in 2 units horizontal (50-percent slope). Change in level greater than 1/2 inch (12.7 mm) shall be accomplished by means of a ramp.


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## LGreene (Apr 18, 2012)

mark handler said:
			
		

> Surface mounted ones also do not meet ADA


http://idighardware.com/2012/03/decoded-flush-bottom-rails/


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## mark handler (Apr 18, 2012)

LGreene said:
			
		

> http://idighardware.com/2012/03/decoded-flush-bottom-rails/


To quote Lori's webpage



> The 10-inch-high space must have a smooth surface, so bottom rods and latches of surface-mounted vertical exit devices, kick-down and plunger holders, surface bolts, automatic door bottoms, and full-height door pulls would not meet the intent of this requirement.


I knew that


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