# Ceiling finish in an existing historic building



## SVFD6 (Jun 30, 2015)

First post from a newbie still going through the cert processes:

Thanks for this outstanding resource.

Ok, the building inspector (also new) just stopped by to ask me to look at a renovation he is watching.  It is a change of use and occupancy in a historic 130-140 year old nonsprinklered type V building.  The owner has uncovered the original wood wainscot type of paneled ceiling and wants to leave it.  It appears to be spruce or pine.  The building inspector wants him to cover it with drywall because he is installing gas dryers for a laundromat.  Am I using the 2006 IFC correctly by choosing untreated southern pine as an approximate material in the typical flame spread numbers in figure 803.1(3)?  It gives a range of 130 to 190 which is with the range of 76 to 200 listed for class C materials (Class C determined from table 803.3 - "Interior wall and ceiling finish requirements by occupancy") in section 803.1.1.  I am thinking the original ceiling is ok.  Am I on the right path?


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## RLGA (Jun 30, 2015)

"Figure 803.1(3)"? There is no such figure in the IFC.  Are you looking at the commentary possibly?

If the ceiling is only required to have a Class C finish, and you have documentation that the material has flame spread AND smoke developed indices that comply with a Class C finish, then it should be okay.  The problem may lie in the applied finish.  If you are unsure about the existing finish, you might be able to test a piece of the actual ceiling by sacrificing a portion for a test sample.  If it fails, there are wood finish products that will provide up to a Class A finish.


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## mark handler (Jun 30, 2015)

RLGA said:
			
		

> "Figure 803.1(3)"? There is no such figure in the IFC.  Are you looking at the commentary possibly?


IBC??

http://publicecodes.cyberregs.com/icod/ibc/2009f2cc/icod_ibc_2009f2cc_8_par011.htm


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## cda (Jul 1, 2015)

Welcome.....


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## cda (Jul 1, 2015)

You should not be determing what a material falls under.

The contractor should supply you with documentation of what the material is and burning characteristics.

Not sure why the building official is worried about the gas dryers.

They will be properly vented to the outside, and should be very little heat build up.

Ask the building official what section of the code he is using to require sheet rock.

This can be a learning experience for both of you.

Note: if it is not in a code book, do not try to enforce it.


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## cda (Jul 1, 2015)

What state are you in??

It sometimes helps in answering a question


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## FM William Burns (Jul 1, 2015)

Welcome!

Hint............... "Figure" typically refers to a diagram or photo example in a code or standard where the term "Table" (which does exist in the IFC for this question) should have been mentioned as generally referring to text extensions.  Using a proper term is important for a certified inspector 

P.S. Yea, I can be a A...H..... but the poster is going through the certification process and this is a teachable moment ;-)


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## north star (Jul 1, 2015)

*@ = = @ = = @*



SVFD6,

Also, ...a Welcome to The Building Codes Forum !     

Don't let the commenters deter you from coming here.

This resource is *THE BEST* on the internet, and we have a

GREAT bunch of people on here who are ready, willing

and able to help you.

FWIW, ...I hope you DO have some thick skin !   :mrgreen:



*@ = = @ = = @*


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## mtlogcabin (Jul 1, 2015)

> Am I on the right path?


Yes you are on the right path. Check and double check the footnotes and see if they may be applicable. The gas dryers should not be a problem provided the proper clearances are maintained for the exhaust vents.


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## SVFD6 (Jul 1, 2015)

What a great resource you guys are.  Thanks very much to everyone for your replies, they are all very helpful and yes north star I do have adequately thick skin    I definitely should have been more precise about reading the commentary and FM I anticipate many more teachable moments ahead.

cda I'm in southwest Colorado.

Thanks again everyone.


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## cda (Jul 1, 2015)

SVFD6 said:
			
		

> What a great resource you guys are.  Thanks very much to everyone for your replies, they are all very helpful and yes north star I do have adequately thick skin    I definitely should have been more precise about reading the commentary and FM I anticipate many more teachable moments ahead.cda I'm in southwest Colorado.
> 
> Thanks again everyone.


You to can be a "sawhorse"

And help keep the site going

You will not find a better site

http://www.thebuildingcodeforum.com/forum/payments.php


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## SVFD6 (Jul 1, 2015)

Done.  Thanks again.


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## cda (Jul 1, 2015)

SVFD6 said:
			
		

> Done.  Thanks again.


Fantastic!!!!

Two more sawhorses and I get a toaster!!!!


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## north star (Jul 1, 2015)

*+ % + % +*





> "Done.  Thanks again."


*“Excellent”*





*+ % + % +*


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## steveray (Jul 2, 2015)

I believe the FS/SD numbers are based on white oak maybe? So most of the wood I have seen meets class C, but as Ron said, you have to look out for what it might be coated with....


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## FM William Burns (Jul 6, 2015)

> I definitely should have been more precise about reading the commentary and FM I anticipate many more teachable moments ahead.


No problem SVFD6 and............ YES WELCOME!  Best wishes and good for you knowing and using great resources to learn more.  I hope you're going through the NFPA certification program ;-)


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## SVFD6 (Jul 7, 2015)

FM William Burns said:
			
		

> No problem SVFD6 and............ YES WELCOME!  Best wishes and good for you knowing and using great resources to learn more.  I hope you're going through the NFPA certification program ;-)


Yes I'm doing NFPA first and will be taking the test later this month and after the practicum on to ICC...


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## FM William Burns (Jul 7, 2015)

> Yes I'm doing NFPA first and will be taking the test later this month and after the practicum on to ICC...


Excellent SVFD6........... I highly recommend doing all the levels but I'm a bit biased since I assisted in their development and teach them.  Feel free to PM me if necessary and wishing you all the best in the quest!


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## ADAguy (Jul 27, 2015)

Side question: What is the ceiling height of the space?


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## SVFD6 (Jul 28, 2015)

It's been a few weeks but my recollection is 10'.

Update: The BI is making him upgrade because of a change of occupancy next door and above, at the time I didn't realize that was going to happen, thought he was asking me about that space only. Once again FM precise communication...


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