# pizza ovens, need assistance, type 1 or type 2



## codeworks

ok, electric (convection) pizza ovens, gas fired pizza ovens, don't produce "grease laden vapors " like a deep fat fryer or range cook top or broiler will. i'd say a type 2 hood is sufficient for the pizza oven. not a type one with supression, which would be required over a fryer (actually dry chem) due to grease/water splash issues, but you get the drift, not a broiler, not a range, just an oven. any ideas or input.


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## AegisFPE

I have seen a report from a lab commissioned by a national chain/franchise for a conveyor oven for the various food stuffs they would send through the oven. The report quantified the amount of grease produced and concluded it was sufficiently low enough to utilize a Type 2 hood.

Of course, your oven and food stuffs may be different, and the local authority would need to accept the concept of "sufficiently low enough" which does not exist in the code.


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## firemanx

I would side with the requirement for the type 2 hood; however...

Just for clarification and discussion, since that involves the mechanical code (ICC), I believe it also states that part of the purpose of a type 2 hood is if the HVAC system can not also handle the added water vapor or undesirable food odor, therefore I would think it prudent to involve the AHJ that handles the mechanical code approval/enforcement (ICC)?  In my jurisdiction, that would fall with the building department.  So in other words it's a code that involves two AHJ's, fire code official and building official.


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## fatboy

Electric....would look and see, sorry, gas fired, solid fuel........IMHO, you they produce grease, worked in them, sorry. Type I for those for sure.


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## Mac

See Fatboy's above comment... Yes pizzas produce grease laden vapors, as do the other foods cooked in them.


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## fireguy

I have seen both Type I and Type II over pizza appliances.  Pizza ovens do not seem to generate the amount of grease that the conveyer chain ovens do.  When there is a fire in closed oven, keeping the door closed will contain the fire.  But in a conveyer chain type of cooker, the fire is not contained behind closed doors. That type of appliance should be under a Type I hood and duct work, protected by a UL300 suppression system. I have seen more than pizza cooked.  When burgers and chicken wings are cooked, more grease is produced.  The last pizza place I was involved in had a Type I exhaust and an Ansul R 102 suppression system installed to protect a chain type oven.


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## BSSTG

Greetings,

If the pizza oven is a conveyor type of oven it must be Type I per the 09 IMC as it's rated a medium duty cooking appliance. If no conveyor then it would be light-duty and would not be required to have a Type I unless it's producing grease-laden vapors. I recall there being a change from the 06 to 09 IMC in this regard as the definition of these types of appliances changed.

MEDIUM-DUTY COOKING APPLIANCE. Medium-duty cooking appliances include electric discrete element ranges (with or without oven), electric and gas hot-top ranges, electric and gas griddles, electric and gas double-sided griddles, electric and gas fryers (including open deep fat fryers, donut fryers, kettle fryers and pressure fryers), electric and gas conveyor pizza ovens, electric and gas tilting skillets (braising pans) and electric and gas rotisseries.

BSSTG


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## FM William Burns

Forgive the length of this guys and gals but we got tired of all the banter so we decided to come up with this (for now):




*CONVEYER /HORIZONTAL BROILER TYPE PIZZA OVENS*

*FIRE PROTECTION & TYPE I HOODS*
​
*Summary:*

The question of do the codes require pizza ovens to be supplied with a Type I exhaust hood and fire suppression equipment has been debated by code officials for many years. The code does not specifically say yes however, the codes do suggest that these ovens if cooking materials that produce grease will require protection. Facilities have gone beyond just merely cooking pizza and now have entered upon cooking other foods through the oven like chicken wings, ribs, cheesy pasta dishes etc. These foods will produce and are subjected to temperatures above 400 degrees allowing for grease and smoke development.

Code Analysis on current adopted codes:

*MBC 2009*

*904.2.1 Commercial hood and duct systems.* Each required commercial kitchen exhaust hood and duct system required by Section 609 of the International Fire Code or Chapter 5 of the International Mechanical Code to have a Type I hood shall be protected with an approved automatic fire-extinguishing system installed in accordance with this code. [F]

*IFC 2009 (As referenced)*

*SECTION 602 DEFINITIONS **COMMERCIAL COOKING APPLIANCES.* Appliances used in a commercial food service establishment for heating or cooking food and which produce grease vapors, steam, fumes, smoke or odors that are required to be removed through a local exhaust ventilation system. Such appliances include deep fat fryers; upright broilers; griddles; broilers; steam-jacketed kettles; hot-top ranges; under-fired broilers (charbroilers); *ovens*; barbecues; rotisseries; and similar appliances. For the purpose of this definition, a food service establishment shall include any building or a portion thereof used for the preparation and serving of food. [M] 

*609.2 Where required.* A Type I hood shall be installed at or above all commercial cooking appliances and domestic cooking appliances used for commercial purposes that produce grease vapors. [M]The code commentary for this section reads “An exhaust system is required for all appliances used for commercial cooking as defined in Section 602. In addition to the specific cooking appliances identified in the definition, further examples of commercial cooking appliances that require a commercial exhaust system are griddles (flat or grooved); tilting skillets or woks; braising and frying pans; roasters; pastry ovens; *pizza ovens*; char broilers, salamanders and upright broilers; infrared broilers and open-burner stoves and ranges.”

*MMC 2009 (As referenced)*

*507.2.1 Type I hoods.* Type I hoods shall be installed where cooking appliances produce grease or smoke. Type I hoods shall be installed over medium-duty, heavy-duty and extra-heavy-duty cooking appliances. Type I hoods shall be installed over light-duty cooking appliances that produce grease or smoke.

*509.1 Where required*. Commercial cooking appliances required by Section 507.2.1 to have a Type I hood shall be provided with an approved automatic fire suppression system complying with the International Building Code and the International Fire Code.

*Conclusion:*

CFD has the opinion that an increased fire hazard does exist by facilities cooking other grease producing materials in an oven manufactured and intended for baking pizzas. The ovens being used for cooking foods that do produce grease and smoke would require the installation of a Type I hood and fire suppression as required by adopted codes. In existing operations compliance with the new 2009 codes adopted locally will only apply to facilities changing their cooking appliances or operations and will not be applied to facilities being in existence prior to the adoption of the 2009 codes.


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## fatboy

Thanks for that.......


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## Herbert

AegisFPE said:


> I have seen a report from a lab commissioned by a national chain/franchise for a conveyor oven for the various food stuffs they would send through the oven. The report quantified the amount of grease produced and concluded it was sufficiently low enough to utilize a Type 2 hood.
> 
> Of course, your oven and food stuffs may be different, and the local authority would need to accept the concept of "sufficiently low enough" which does not exist in the code.


Could you tell me the report you are referring to?


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## cda

Herbert said:


> Could you tell me the report you are referring to?




Texas??


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## cda

Herbert said:


> Could you tell me the report you are referring to?



I think there has been past discussion on places that cook chicken wings and such in pizza ovens 

Check the edition of IMC  you are under. 

It has gotten tougher on when Type I hoods are needed


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## cda

Herbert said:


> Could you tell me the report you are referring to?



I would suggest letting the applicant request lower than what the code requires.


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## Herbert

cda said:


> Texas??


What do you mean "Texas?"   I'm trying to figure out what report shows that a pizza chain's grease emissions are low enough that they do not require their oven to be protected by a type 1 hood.


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## cda

Herbert said:


> What do you mean "Texas?"   I'm trying to figure out what report shows that a pizza chain's grease emissions are low enough that they do not require their oven to be protected by a type 1 hood.




Your profile says Carrollton


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## cda

So first it looks like the exception applies to electric only


Exception: A Type I hood shall not be required for an electric cooking appliance where an approved testing agency provides documentation that the appliance effluent contains 5 mg/m3 or less of grease when tested at an exhaust flow rate of 500 cfm (0.236 m3/s) in accordance with UL 710B.


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## cda

Seems like each appliance type/ brand would have to be tested.

Will see what the commentary says on Monday


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## cda

Not sure if this helps any,,

Starting about page 34


http://www.me.umn.edu/labs/teel/files/Research/Rocklage01.pdf


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## mtlogcabin

I believe the code is pretty clear that a Type I hood is required over a conveyor pizza oven because it is defined as a Medium Duty  Cooking Appliance regardless of the menu.

507.2.1 Type I hoods.
Type I hoods shall be installed where cooking appliances produce grease or smoke as a result of the cooking process. Type I hoods shall be installed over medium-duty, heavy-duty and extra-heavy-duty cooking appliances. Type I hoods shall be installed over light-duty cooking appliances that produce grease or smoke.

MEDIUM-DUTY COOKING APPLIANCE. Medium-duty cooking appliances include electric discrete element ranges (with or without oven), electric and gas hot-top ranges, electric and gas griddles, electric and gas double-sided griddles, electric and gas fryers (including open deep fat fryers, donut fryers, kettle fryers and pressure fryers), electric and gas conveyor pizza ovens, electric and gas tilting skillets (braising pans) and electric and gas rotisseries.


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## cda

mtlogcabin said:


> I believe the code is pretty clear that a Type I hood is required over a conveyor pizza oven because it is defined as a Medium Duty  Cooking Appliance regardless of the menu.
> 
> 507.2.1 Type I hoods.
> Type I hoods shall be installed where cooking appliances produce grease or smoke as a result of the cooking process. Type I hoods shall be installed over medium-duty, heavy-duty and extra-heavy-duty cooking appliances. Type I hoods shall be installed over light-duty cooking appliances that produce grease or smoke.
> 
> MEDIUM-DUTY COOKING APPLIANCE. Medium-duty cooking appliances include electric discrete element ranges (with or without oven), electric and gas hot-top ranges, electric and gas griddles, electric and gas double-sided griddles, electric and gas fryers (including open deep fat fryers, donut fryers, kettle fryers and pressure fryers), electric and gas conveyor pizza ovens, electric and gas tilting skillets (braising pans) and electric and gas rotisseries.




Exception: A Type I hood shall not be required for an electric cooking appliance where an approved testing agency provides documentation that the appliance effluent contains 5 mg/m3 or less of grease when tested at an exhaust flow rate of 500 cfm (0.236 m3/s) in accordance with UL 710B.


Have not looked at the commentary.

I am wondering if each appliance has to be tested


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## cda

Can someone post the commentary to the exception???

All I have is the 09 and it is not there.


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## Sifu

2012 exception commentary.


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## cda

Thanks

So I did read it correctly

Every appliance has to have its own testing,

To use the exception


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## Pcinspector1

cda,

Was that Texas Company out of Dallas and was the oven a Ovention, Model C2000, Conveyor oven with a (UL) report with the conclusion that it does not require a hood?


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## cda

Pcinspector1 said:


> cda,
> 
> Was that Texas Company out of Dallas and was the oven a Ovention, Model C2000, Conveyor oven with a (UL) report with the conclusion that it does not require a hood?




I am not sure

I have not seen a report before, and no one has ever asked me to use the exception


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## Sifu

I ask for verification with that section quite often.  Sometimes I even get it.


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## ICE

Herbert said:


> What do you mean "Texas"?.


Could be New York City....I don’t know why people live there either.


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## ICE

Herbert said:


> What do you mean "Texas?"   I'm trying to figure out what report shows that a pizza chain's grease emissions are low enough that they do not require their oven to be protected by a type 1 hood.



You might get different answers from one jurisdiction to the next.  The one you are dealing with has been down this road....more than once. No matter what you find in the rest of the world it’s an easy question to ask..  I bet that the answer is on the tip of her tongue.  Shirley call Carrollton.


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## cda

ICE said:


> You might get different answers from one jurisdiction to the next.  The one you are dealing with has been down this road....more than once. No matter what you find in the rest of the world it’s an easy question to ask..  I bet that the answer is on the tip of her tongue.  Shirley call Carrollton.




His info says Fire Marshal


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## ICE

cda said:


> His info says Fire Marshal


Oh.  Well then never mind.


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## rgrace

Wow, sometimes you folk split off in so many different paths it's hard to follow. The following is based on the 2015 IMC - Electric pizza oven (enclosed), Type II hood unless heat and moisture loads can be incorporated into HVAC system per Section 507.3. Gas pizza oven (enclosed), Type II hood (produces products of combustion per Section 507.3). Electric or gas pizza oven (conveyor), Type I hood (see mtlogcabin post referencing 2012 IMC - 2015 hasn't changed). Convection oven (enclosed) (tested through UL Category KNLZ which BTW uses pizzas to conduct the test), no hood required based on Section 507.2 Exception (that was for you cda). These are generally small, countertop installed cooking appliances. Solid fuel fired pizza oven (required to be open to operate), Type I hood per Section 507.2. I think that covers all of the different ways to cook pizza.


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## cda

rgrace said:


> Wow, sometimes you folk split off in so many different paths it's hard to follow. The following is based on the 2015 IMC - Electric pizza oven (enclosed), Type II hood unless heat and moisture loads can be incorporated into HVAC system per Section 507.3. Gas pizza oven (enclosed), Type II hood (produces products of combustion per Section 507.3). Electric or gas pizza oven (conveyor), Type I hood (see mtlogcabin post referencing 2012 IMC - 2015 hasn't changed). Convection oven (enclosed) (tested through UL Category KNLZ which BTW uses pizzas to conduct the test), no hood required based on Section 507.2 Exception (that was for you cda). These are generally small, countertop installed cooking appliances. Solid fuel fired pizza oven (required to be open to operate), Type I hood per Section 507.2. I think that covers all of the different ways to cook pizza.





I would agree an enclosed oven does not require a type I hood


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## mtlogcabin

Existing chain pizza oven under a Type II hood. Old chain oven removed and new chain oven installed. 
Do you make them update the entire hood? 
Just install a suppression system?
Just allow the change out and require nothing?
This just came into our office today and there are different opinion on how to handle it.
It will never meet the exception part so that is out.


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## mtlogcabin

Forgot to mention this is a national chain warehouse store that does about 250 pizzas per day through this oven.


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## Sifu

Update to type I if it were me.


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## rgrace

Tough call. In my jurisdiction, like-for-like changes are permitted without bringing up to current code requirements provided the change does not increase the hazard. If this can be considered an upgrade rather than a like-for-like, that can be considered a hazard increase. If the cooking appliance has the ability to cook more pizzas than the previous cooking appliance, that can be considered a hazard increase. Would prefer to see a Type I hood, but would need to provide solid, code justification for requiring such.


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## steveray

Would you allow them to install a dry niche luminaire in a pool because the pool was existing? They want to install a piece of equipment, not in accordance with it's listing imo....


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## Pcinspector1

There are some conveyor type pizza ovens that are vent-less and (UL) approved one comes to mind is the Ovention 

Matchbox-1718-Ventless-Commercial-Oven.

No hood required


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## rgrace

steveray said:


> Would you allow them to install a dry niche luminaire in a pool because the pool was existing? They want to install a piece of equipment, not in accordance with it's listing imo....



Without doing research, was there a time when a dry niche luminaire was permitted by the code? There have been a lot of changes made to the hood requirements of the IMC, and there are installations out there that do not meet current code requirements. If a cooking appliance has met its life expectancy and needs to be replaced, is this just cause to require that all other aspects associated with this cooking appliance be brought up to current code requirements if the hazard associated with a like-for-like replacement is not increased? It wasn't until the 2003 IMC that definitions of cooking appliance "duty" was introduced and a distinction was made between a conveyor oven (light duty) and a conveyor pizza oven (medium duty), and not until the 2009 IMC that the light-duty conveyor oven was changed to "countertop conveyorized baking/finishing" oven. IMO, replacing a piece of equipment like-for-like because it no longer functions correctly doesn't automatically justify the retrofit of other systems to meet current code requirements. Increased hazards must first be evaluated and justification provided for retrofit enforcement. 

I don't understand the second statement, please clarify ..... the listing doesn't dictate hood requirements, and I didn't see reference in this thread that the proposed cooking appliance would be installed in such a way that it would not conform to the listing ........ or was that referencing the dry niche luminaire?


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## rgrace

Pcinspector1 said:


> There are some conveyor type pizza ovens that are vent-less and (UL) approved one comes to mind is the Ovention
> 
> Matchbox-1718-Ventless-Commercial-Oven.
> 
> No hood required



Cool ! That's one of those UL KNLZ listed cooking appliances


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## Harvie S Jones

cda said:


> Exception: A Type I hood shall not be required for an electric cooking appliance where an approved testing agency provides documentation that the appliance effluent contains 5 mg/m3 or less of grease when tested at an exhaust flow rate of 500 cfm (0.236 m3/s) in accordance with UL 710B.
> 
> 
> Have not looked at the commentary.
> 
> I am wondering if each appliance has to be tested


Yes, each appliance shall be tested and verifies. At leas per my state FIRE Marshalls ruling.


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## cda

Welcome Harvey!!!


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