# Maneuvering Clearances at doors



## rktect 1 (Feb 17, 2010)

Illinois accessibility code question.

On a review I made a review comment that the handicap accessible bathroom door needed to meet the requirement for fig 25a.  Which depicts the direction of travel towards a door on the push side that swings into the bathroom.  On the outside of the door it shows a 48" deep by dimension of the door plus x wide area to navigate opening the door.  A note is at the bottom.  x = 12 in. if door has both a closer and latch.

The DP called and said he was under the impression that if he did not provide the closer nor the latch, that this 12 inch maneuvering clearance was not required.

Now I am feeling a bit confused.  On page 48 for "doors" #5 lists maneuvering clearances at doors and does not seem to exempt out doors for not having closers or latches.


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## vegas paul (Feb 17, 2010)

Re: Maneuvering Clearances at doors

I assume you are referencing a local code which is similar/identical to figure 404.2.3.1(b) from ANSI A117.1.  This is indicated tabularly in table 404.2.3.1.  The 12" requirement ONLY applies when a closer AND latch are proved.  However, who designs restroom doors without closers and latches?  Unless this is a very odd design, I believe the 12" is applicable.


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## SBerg (Feb 17, 2010)

Re: Maneuvering Clearances at doors

Well, there could be a closer but no latch. Thereby no maneuvering space is required.


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## TJacobs (Feb 17, 2010)

Re: Maneuvering Clearances at doors

What VP said.  No closer AND no latch, 12" not required.


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## georgia plans exam (Feb 17, 2010)

Re: Maneuvering Clearances at doors

I agree with SBerg. The lack of either a closer or a latch would negate the 12" requirement.

GPE


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## Rick18071 (Feb 20, 2010)

Re: Maneuvering Clearances at doors

I see this a lot on final inspections. All the strip malls I go to have the rear doors mounted on the outside of a block wall. So they are never accessible with a latch and closer. I tell them to take the closer off than it will be to code. I don't think the closers stay off for long after I leave.


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## Gene Boecker (Feb 22, 2010)

Re: Maneuvering Clearances at doors

rktect,

On Page 48, the IL Access Code says that the maneuvering clearance needs to be according to Fig 25.  When you turn to Figure 25 on page 138, the "(a)" image contains the language allowing the omission of the 12 inch push side clearance if there is not both a closer and a latch.  So, in the case you cite, the 12 inches isn't needed.

This is consistent with the ADAAG, A117.1, TAS and CA Access Regs - so you're good.


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## Yikes (Feb 22, 2010)

Re: Maneuvering Clearances at doors

FYI, I've been told that the reasoning behind this is that a latch AND closer require both dexterity and force to operate the door.

Thus, a very frail person may need to center their body in front of the door handle so that they can both push the lever down and push the door open.  The 12" gives room for their body to be centered on the door handle.

This situation occurs only when both the latch and the closer are present, otherwise:

* No latch = just lean on the door panel and it will open

* No closer = not much strength or leverage force needed by the limb that is operating the door handle.


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## Rick18071 (Feb 23, 2010)

Re: Maneuvering Clearances at doors

Does anyone know if panic doors going to the outside have to have a closer. I don't know how they would close without one, they never have a handle inside to pull them close.


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## Coug Dad (Feb 23, 2010)

Re: Maneuvering Clearances at doors

A door closer would only be required if the door is required to have a fire resistive rating, unless there is a provision in the energy code as a part of the building envelop provisions.


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## rktect 1 (Feb 23, 2010)

Re: Maneuvering Clearances at doors

Thanks for all the responses.  Very helpful.


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## Gene Boecker (Feb 23, 2010)

Re: Maneuvering Clearances at doors

FYI, Rick.

Doors to the outside with panic bars are not required to have closers.  The panic bar is for single action opening not fire rating.  The only exception is if the door needs to act as an opening protective device such as is the case if the wall needs a rating per Table 602 or if the path outside is an exit court.


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## Coug Dad (Feb 23, 2010)

Re: Maneuvering Clearances at doors

If the door is reqiured to be rated it should have Fire Exit Hardware.  Panic Hardware is for non rated doors.


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## TJacobs (Feb 23, 2010)

Re: Maneuvering Clearances at doors



			
				Gene Boecker said:
			
		

> FYI, Rick.Doors to the outside with panic bars are not required to have closers.  The panic bar is for single action opening not fire rating.  The only exception is if the door needs to act as an opening protective device such as is the case if the wall needs a rating per Table 602 or if the path outside is an exit court.


You will also need closers on doors with panic bars to a vestibule:

2006 IECC

502.4.6 Vestibules.

A door that separates conditioned space from the exterior shall be protected with an enclosed vestibule, with all doors opening into and out of the vestibule equipped with self-closing devices.


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## Gene Boecker (Feb 23, 2010)

Re: Maneuvering Clearances at doors

Ooooooooo!

Good catch, Jake.  The old "What's in another code that's building related but not building code text" trick!


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## Rick18071 (Feb 23, 2010)

Re: Maneuvering Clearances at doors

I just looked up exterior area for assisted rescue (IBC 1007.7). This needs a 3/4 hour door. This is realy going to screw up a restaurant I am inspecting. It needs a 2nd accessable exit and the plans show they are using the back door that goes out to a landing and stairs. The landing is ok for size for an area for assisted rescue but they will need a closer and latch. The plans didn't show that the wall is 12" thick and won't get the maneuvering clearance for the door. Maybe it would work if they mount the door on the inside of the wall. Any thoughts?


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## Rick18071 (Feb 23, 2010)

Re: Maneuvering Clearances at doors

Does anyone know if the manufacturer's instructions for the panic door hardware requier door closers?


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