# Drilled Holes in Wood and Strain Relief



## Mule (Oct 19, 2010)

Okay, had a meeting with a local contractor and I need to know how you guys feel about this scenario.Hole drilled around 3/4 from face of stud but the wire is toward the back of the hole. The electrician says this type of installation is okay because it meets the intent of the code of being at least 1 1/4 inches from the face of the stud.We brought copies of the section of the code for the last three code cycles where the code specifies the hole for the wire shall be at least 1 1/4 inches from the face of the stud.He still believes this type of installation meets the intent of the code.What is your opinion. We say add a nail plate. Pictures below and two more questions on the same house.

View attachment 1412


View attachment 1413


This is more of a uh huh...sure than anything else.Stress relief on double gang boxes. I saw that there were "stress" marks on the plastic box where the romex was pulled through the box. Electrician said is was due to a faulty product and that when they pull the wires through it was causing the strees marks and then the tabs would not spring back to secure the wire.I said are you sure your not jabbing the screw driver in there and reaming the tabs so it is easier to pull the wires through???? Uhhh no!!! Well then what happened on this box then?
	

		
			
		

		
	

View attachment 1416


View attachment 1415


Next....how many wires under a staple???? Electrician says.. he uses S100's...don't know what the pecs are but.....
	

		
			
		

		
	

View attachment 1417


View attachment 1412


View attachment 1413


View attachment 1415


View attachment 1416


View attachment 1417


/monthly_2010_10/572953de1fc18_ShadyValleyElectricalFrank005.jpg.89f131380267631c1b854a172b17d774.jpg

/monthly_2010_10/572953de24f1e_ShadyValleyElectricalFrank004.jpg.199a334bf355de26987e1782fea6cf52.jpg

/monthly_2010_10/572953de2eaae_ShadyValleyElectricalFrank008.jpg.2b5c93d94b1b94d563f596fe6a1568aa.jpg

/monthly_2010_10/572953de33c8e_ShadyValleyElectricalFrank002.jpg.6c65a48a08d1a9be0314bda24c43e591.jpg

/monthly_2010_10/572953de38065_ShadyValleyElectricalFrank010.jpg.a436219eae4fe56dc0b94519019b0875.jpg


----------



## RJJ (Oct 19, 2010)

Looks to me that the boxes need to be replaced. As for the bored holes @ 3/4" I say needs protection. Not sure what pecs means?

Specs for 100S staples I believe is the question!????


----------



## 480sparky (Oct 19, 2010)

It doesn't matter where the cable is in the hole, if _the edge of the hole_ is less than 1¼" from the face of the stud, it needs protection.  300.4(A)(1).


----------



## Mule (Oct 19, 2010)

RJJ said:
			
		

> Looks to me that the boxes need to be replaced. As for the bored holes @ 3/4" I say needs protection. Not sure what pecs means?Specs for 100S staples I believe is the question!????


Sorry..yes Specs....


----------



## Rio (Oct 19, 2010)

Nail plates are cheap, if in doubt use 'em.  As to the plastic tabs, they can be very difficult to work with and actually can strip insulation.  As long as the wires are stapled to the framing within a reasonable distance, no big deal on that.


----------



## GHRoberts (Oct 19, 2010)

A little bit of insulation stuffed in the hole will keep the cable more than 1-1/4" from the face. That seems to meet the intent of the code.


----------



## globe trekker (Oct 19, 2010)

*[1]* Provide a minimum a 1 1/4" of permanent separation distance from the

edge, or nail guard them, ...*[2]* replace the boxes or secure the conductors nearby

to the framed element, ...*[3]* Conductors shall not be stapled on their edge - in

the 2006 IRC, see Table E3702.1, Note " i ".

.


----------



## RJJ (Oct 19, 2010)

Mule Just kidding! I new what you had said/typed!


----------



## Bootleg (Oct 19, 2010)

Nail plates required.


----------



## chris kennedy (Oct 19, 2010)

GHRoberts said:
			
		

> A little bit of insulation stuffed in the hole will keep the cable more than 1-1/4" from the face. That seems to meet the intent of the code.


I would disagree with the above statement and side with mule and 480.



> 300.4(A)(1) Bored Holes. In both exposed and concealed locations, where a cable- or raceway-type wiring method is installed through bored holes in joists, rafters, or wood members, holes shall be bored so that the edge of the hole is not less than 32 mm (1¼ in.) from the nearest edge of the wood member. Where this distance cannot be maintained, the cable or raceway shall be protected from penetration by screws or nails by a steel plate(s) or bushing(s), at least 1.6 mm ( in.) thick, and of appropriate length and width installed to cover the area of the wiring.Exception No. 1:  Steel plates shall not be required to protect rigid metal conduit, intermediate metal conduit, rigid nonmetallic conduit, or electrical metallic tubing.
> 
> Exception No. 2:  A listed and marked steel plate less than 1.6 mm ( in.) thick that provides equal or better protection against nail or screw penetration shall be permitted.


----------



## 480sparky (Oct 19, 2010)

GHRoberts said:
			
		

> A little bit of insulation stuffed in the hole will keep the cable more than 1-1/4" from the face. That seems to meet the intent of the code.


Won't work.  If the hole is less than 1¼" from the face of the stud, it needs a nail plate.  The title of 300.4(A)(1) is* Bored Holes*, not *Distance from Stud Face to Where the Cable is Placed*.


----------



## GHRoberts (Oct 20, 2010)

I would say that the insulation moves the edge of the hole ...


----------



## Bootleg (Oct 20, 2010)

I would agree, that is a good field inspectors fix to meet the intent of the code and not have a nail or screw go into the romex.


----------



## 480sparky (Oct 21, 2010)

GHRoberts said:
			
		

> I would say that the insulation moves the edge of the hole ...


No, the hole is still in the same place.


----------



## GHRoberts (Oct 21, 2010)

480sparky said:
			
		

> No, the hole is still in the same place.


Would wood filler move the edge of the hole? Or are you just trying to cause the builder a problem?


----------



## georgia plans exam (Oct 21, 2010)

Insulation??? Wood filler??? Cause the builder a problem????

Install the darn nail plate. What is it? about $1.00 and 30 seconds labor time. Wow!

GPE


----------



## Lurker (Oct 21, 2010)

Would a permit be required to move a hole?


----------



## globe trekker (Oct 21, 2010)

Agree with GPE! Just install the nail guard.

Something like this.










Cost = less than a dollar when purchased in volume.

.


----------



## mtlogcabin (Oct 21, 2010)

The bundled conductors in the last picture are suppose to be 1.25 inches from the edge of the stud and they are not. Now some will say it is protected by the sheathing but is it? Has the siding been installed? Will the cable guy put a staple in it when he runs the cable? In 2x4 construction you basically have 1 inch for the installation but that would require workmanship and some one who cared about their work.

Where run parallel with the framing member or furring strip, the wiring shall be not less than 1¼ inches from the edge of a furring strip or a framing member such as a joist, rafter or stud or shall be physically protected.


----------



## 480sparky (Oct 21, 2010)

GHRoberts said:
			
		

> Would wood filler move the edge of the hole? Or are you just trying to cause the builder a problem?


Not trying to cause anyone a problem.  Just trying to comply with code.


----------



## texas transplant (Oct 21, 2010)

georgia plans exam said:
			
		

> Insulation??? Wood filler??? Cause the builder a problem????Install the darn nail plate. What is it? about $1.00 and 30 seconds labor time. Wow!
> 
> GPE


I agree wholeheartedly.    Of all the things we fight around here, nail plates are one of the hottest, and it has so little effect on the cost.   What makes matters worse is a lot of the larger homes have lots of 2x6 walls that running a single wire thru the center should be easy, but they can't seem to hit the center of the board for anything.

I wish oh wish I had had my camera the other day, the framers had built a chase for the electrician to run the wires to the panel, but the electrician ignored the chase and just butchered the top plates and the rest of the wall to get the wires in.  Then complained when the framer handed him a bill for the damage.  Go figure.


----------



## texas transplant (Oct 21, 2010)

GHRoberts said:
			
		

> Would wood filler move the edge of the hole? Or are you just trying to cause the builder a problem?


The hole is still there.   And I can assume most times that a stud will all stay in place in a wall, but if you fill a hole in the stud with wood filler how long before the wood filler dries out enough to fall out of the hole and let the wire start rubbing on the nail.  I am not just worried that the drywallers etc. will drive a nail thru a wire or a pipe, I don't want the wire or the pipe to become exposed to the nail or screw and have the opportunity to rub against it inside the wall over a period of time.


----------



## Darren Emery (Oct 21, 2010)

Insulation compresses, wood filler dries and falls out.  Diamonds, and nailplates if installed correctly, last forever.


----------



## Pcinspector1 (Oct 21, 2010)

Mule,

Stud guard it!

Blue electrical box, tabs go down to prevent wire from sliding back out!

Becareful of the diversion, He's done some other things not to code I bet! Old contractor trick to take your attention away from the big code violation!

pc1


----------



## jar546 (Oct 21, 2010)

Protector plates are an easy fix for compliance.

Tell him to stop using staples in places like that and use the 3M standoffs or another brand of his choice.

Simple problems, simple solutions


----------



## Uncle Bob (Oct 21, 2010)

They should not allow nail plates.  They should drill new holes and install it correctly.

But, you have to allow for incompetence; when writing the codes.

Uncle Bob


----------



## Jobsaver (Oct 21, 2010)

Uncle Bob said:
			
		

> They should not allow nail plates.  They should drill new holes and install it correctly.But, you have to allow for incompetence; when writing the codes.
> 
> Uncle Bob


*GOOD POST!*



			
				jar546 said:
			
		

> Protector plates are an easy fix for compliance.Tell him to stop using staples in places like that and use the 3M standoffs or another brand of his choice.
> 
> Simple problems, simple solutions


We encourage the use of plastic ties for multiple wires to reduce the number of staples while keeping wires centered. Staple one or two wires . . . tie any additional wires to those.

Ties are cheap, but not listed. Still, I believe the intent of the code is met.


----------



## 480sparky (Oct 21, 2010)

Uncle Bob said:
			
		

> They should not allow nail plates.  They should drill new holes and install it correctly.But, you have to allow for incompetence; when writing the codes.
> 
> Uncle Bob


Try drilling a 2x2 then.


----------

