# ICC announces new Code Forum!



## brudgers

Just kidding.


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## texasbo

V767 just cried his pants.


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## mtlogcabin

You do have a sense of humor and it isn't even April 1st  

Good one


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## V767

Why would I cry my pants? Or did you mean crap? I am trying to figure that one out.

I liked this though. It was funny. I mean I more laughed than cried, or crapped, or whichever.

V767


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## pwood

V767 said:
			
		

> Why would I cry my pants? Or did you mean crap? I am trying to figure that one out. I liked this though. It was funny. I mean I more laughed than cried, or crapped, or whichever.
> 
> V767


v767,

it is a texas thing:mrgreen:, brought on by the rangers losing to the giants!


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## V767

pwood said:
			
		

> v767,it is a texas thing:mrgreen:, brought on by the rangers losing to the giants!


HAHA! I wanted the Rangers to win too, but this is priceless.

V767


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## FyrBldgGuy

I liked the crickets part...

...If a tree falls in the forest does it make a sound?

...If ICC has a code forum does anyone read it?


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## RJJ

NO! It is to hard to navigate! No one is there anyway!

V767:: When you figure it let us know! Or better yet don't let us know. It would be more info then I need to know anyway.

brudgers: You get two ata boys for this thread. LMAO can't believe I even read it.


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## Mech

Great thread to read at the end of a work day.  Still laughing!!!!!


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## Bootleg

And it's free to everyone.


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## peach

and the Denver group not no notice.. interesting.


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## TJacobs

Touché.................


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## Uncle Bob

If and when they do open that Bulletin Board back up like it used to be; they better reserve our old names!!!!!!!!!!

Did that come up in Denver?????

Do you know who I am?  (my favorite line from incompetent builders); lmao   

Uncle Bob


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## fatboy

Actually, I don't recall our old screen names being discussed, but a very good point UB.......after all, there is only ONE fatboy! Guess we will find out when and if they roll out a new platform.


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## jpranch

peach, i noticed. nlmao


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## Uncle Bob

What if the ICC started a new forum and nobody came?

Wouldn't that be a just and final blow to their integrity, and possibly a contributing blow to the ICC's demise? The ICC did not pay a group from our membership to go to Denver; because they are our friends. 

Don't ever forget that they dropped us and the old ICC BB, like a rock with hot poop on it. They are not renewing the "open to all" forum in a new BB, out of the goodness of their rusting hearts; they are in a deep hole; and want us to come back and bring their website back to it's former glory.

They had no idea; but, now admit, that the old BB was what brought and kept many people coming back to, their website; which is their bread and butter (money maker). It was closing the old BB that started the downward fall of the ICC.

What if the ICC brought back their open forum; and nobody came?

Uncle Bob


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## RJJ

UB: I believe that will be the case when all is said and done. No one will be on the new site. I don't agree that closing the old BB was the start of ICC down fall. However, it did play a part. Many things over the last several years have added to the problems at ICC.


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## FM William Burns

Well.....any additional news to share from the Denver crew?


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## fatboy

Haven't heard a peep from ICC......certainly not living up to what was discussed in Denver.


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## robertsamual

brudgers said:
			
		

> Just kidding.


That was quick and humorous. I hope that soon you are going to find the new codes of yourself (Not mentioning what type of codes). May be you can check them out on your mind and then show some *crickets* Ha ha! One official plumbing code for me- PTMBG45GVSR ( don't try to look at this- Its mine   )


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## Big Willie

Been awfully quiet from the ICC Regime as of late.    I thought the Denver Crew had some things

worked out and promised ( <--- ???  ).   A new Bulletin Board, ...possibly some accountability.

Yep!  Awfully quiet!


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## jpranch

Talked to them in Charlotte. Remember the "security breech"? It was worse than told by the cow leadership. It has set the Denver project back quite a bit. Their overall web site still sucks and man is it sloooooooooow! I'm betting that their dicussion board beta will not be seen until at least spring if ever?


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## RJJ

I am glad I am not holding my breath for the new ICC BB. They need to hire someone in the IT field to oversee the project.


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## Uncle Bob

All they have to do is put the old bulletin board back.  The trouble is they think too much.  Shouldn't take any longer to put it back than it did to take it down.

Uncle Bob


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## brudgers

RJJ said:
			
		

> I am glad I am not holding my breath for the new ICC BB. They need to hire someone in the IT field to oversee the project.


Speaking of people hired by the ICC, what happened to our minder?


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## Mech

Uncle Bob said:
			
		

> Shouldn't take any longer to put it back than it did to take it down.Uncle Bob


They probably first have to form a committee, complete a feasibility study, estimate the required manpower, and then do some other standard red tape bureaucratic type stuff before they just "flip the switch" and enable posting on their bulletin board.


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## jpranch

I just took a look at the 
	

		
			
		

		
	

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 website. "The thing of things" STILL requires you to sign in as a member! I would think that, that would be a easy fix? And they wonder why it's dead???

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## fatboy

yeah, I poked around in there a week or so ago, not much activity at all.


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## peach

yeah... no news is.. well... no news... I'm disappointed, but still did enjoy meeting you guys in Denver.. (or outside of Denver, as it turned out).  Was really hoping the "thing of things" would have evolved by now... but, I do understand the budgeting end of things... *sigh*... still waiting Kyle..


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## RJJ

brudgers: Our minder! I believe they have technical difficulties and he can't find the link!

JP! The flaming cow would be more appropriate in green! Just a suggestion!


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## packsaddle

post deleted.


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## jpranch

What goes into the cow and comes out is green enough for me!

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## jpranch

rjj, Happy now?

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## RJJ

That's better! LOL


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## jpranch

Another thread started on this topic.

Here is the link:

http://www.inspectpa.com/phpbb/showthread.php?3572-Update-ish 

Here is the first post:

*Update-ish *

Hey Guys,

Long time not talk. Sorry but things (sounds like an excuse, but really it isn't, or maybe it is...anyway) have been quite hectic around here with Conference, post-Conference and then I was at Greenbuild last month too. Now, the holidays are upon us and we are all pushing hard to try and get the new BB going and approved so we can start building it and testing it.

The phase that we are in right now is still the approval phase. Some things have changed (nothing drastic, but enough to keep us busy on our end) but we are hoping that soon we will see some changes to the website and the current COIs.

I cannot guarantee any timelines or dates of launch. They keep me in the dark about that kind of stuff and just say, "Ok here we go!"

I thoroughly appreciate the patience and understand the impatience. I had a chance to speak to a few members at Conference and had some great talks with them.

As soon as I know anything, you guys will be the first to know.

Happy Holidays and be safe traveling everyone.

V767


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## texasbo

Well by all means he is forgiven if he was at Greenbuild.


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## Uncle Bob

Well, V767

I personally could care less. I'm fed up with the ICC. They are making new codes and changes so fast that a person that did absolutely nothing else could not keep up with all the certifications, new codes and changes.

This crap has spun totally out of control. It's sad enough that most inspectors don't have any certs; and most municipalities want the least qualified any way (it's much cheaper); and, the ICC is piling up new codes and certifications like cord wood.

My certifications renewal was last month; I didn't even bother to turn in the paper work and money; and yes, I do have the required CEUs.

It's quite a relief. No more idiotic CEU classes; given by people that don't have a clue.

This forum has all my code freinds; and I'm staying right here.

Ya'll be good to yourselves,

Uncle Bob


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## Mech

> I personally could care less. I'm fed up with the ICC. They are making new codes and changes so fast that a person that did absolutely nothing else could not keep up with all the certifications, new codes and changes.


Makes me think of some movies, like The Matrix Triology & the Terminator Series where the computers are supposed to help us and end up ruining our lives.

Apparently they don't have enough codes.

From their wedsite "ICC is accepting applications for the Turfgrass and Landscape Irrigation Sprinkler Standard Consensus Committee. Deadline is January 17, 2011."


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## FredK

Uncle Bob said:
			
		

> Well, V767I personally could care less. I'm fed up with the ICC. They are making new codes and changes so fast that a person that did absolutely nothing else could not keep up with all the certifications, new codes and changes.
> 
> This crap has spun totally out of control. It's sad enough that most inspectors don't have any certs; and most municipalities want the least qualified any way (it's much cheaper); and, the ICC is piling up new codes and certifications like cord wood.
> 
> My certifications renewal was last month; I didn't even bother to turn in the paper work and money; and yes, I do have the required CEUs.
> 
> It's quite a relief. No more idiotic CEU classes; given by people that don't have a clue.
> 
> This forum has all my code freinds; and I'm staying right here.
> 
> Ya'll be good to yourselves,
> 
> Uncle Bob


Well said Bob.

I got until March to think about renewing the 8 certs I have or taking early retirement.  Will see what the city's offer is after the first of the year.


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## mtlogcabin

If over 35 don't apply

Greetings from the International Code Council,

As the lead point of contact for an ICC Member Jurisdiction _*your assistance is needed*_ with an ICC outreach initiative to better understand the needs and perspectives of the next generation of code officials. 

As we move forward in our evaluation of how to best enhance the code development process for the benefit of our participants, we wish to conduct a _*series of in-depth interviews with younger code officials*_ – individuals 35 or younger. Our timeline necessitates conducting these interviews right after the first of the year, so we need your help. 

*We are asking our key contacts at all ICC member jurisdictions to reach out to staff in your department under age 35* within their organization and provide them with an opportunity to participate in a brief, anonymous interview. This research will focus on their perspectives toward code development, and the results will help ICC’s ongoing discussion about how to maximize participation in the code development process.

_Please forward this email to your organizational colleagues under age 35_, and ask them to consider participating in the study by clicking on the link below to provide their contact information and consent to an interview. We will be conducting these interviews during the first two weeks in January so please forward this message as soon as possible.

http://www.surveygizmo.com/s3/433308/ICC

Thank you for your support with this important initiative. You may contact Mike Armstrong, ICC Senior Vice President of Membership and Outreach at marmstrong@iccsafe.org with any questions.

Sincerely,

The International Code Council


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## Code Neophyte

I got that one, too.  How many "35 or younger" code officials do they think there are?  If you follow the model set forth in Appendix A (I realize they haven't read their own publications), you have to have a _minimum_ of 10 years experience as a superintendent, architect, engineer, etc.;   So that would imply that you underwent some secondary education - if four years, that puts you at 22.  Then, presumably, you would work your way up into one of those positions that you then hold for ten years.  I would say the _minimum_ age anyone would start in this field is mid-to-late thirties.


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## Mech

Inspector and plans examiners only need 5 years experience.  They would qualify, wouldn't they?

I'm not a code official or I'd sign up.


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## fatboy

We've never had anyone younger than 35 that worked here...........at least in the last 30+ years, much less make it to be a code official.


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## pwood

sounds lke an obvious case of age descrimination to me. anyone know a sleazy out of work lawyer ? e-mail it to me for a cut of the settlement!


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## Uncle Bob

You might note that the ICC did not say ICC Certified Code Officials; as most municipal "Code Officials" are not.

Which brings up an interesting point; should non-certified code officials; who have no certifications; be determining what codes and/or code changes are going to be in the code books?

Uncle Bob


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## ewenme

I have a young inspector, who is 37, but he is thinking that down the road he might like to be a building official, and I suggested that he might want to paticipate in the survey. He can pretend he's still 35!   Shucks, 40 would still be a young 'code official'.


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## Code Neophyte

Uncle Bob said:
			
		

> You might note that the ICC did not say ICC Certified Code Officials; as most municipal "Code Officials" are not.Which brings up an interesting point; should non-certified code officials; who have no certifications; be determining what codes and/or code changes are going to be in the code books?
> 
> Uncle Bob


Now, Bob,

The Code Development Committee, or whatever it's called, which is reviewing the whole code development process and "looking into" remote voting, etc., determined that certification in a given code as a prerequisite to voting on any given code should _not_ be required.  Surely they came to that decision after _much_ thoughtful deliberation, and in the best interest of the future of the codes and the ICC.  Following their sagacious model, why should young inspectors waste their time obtaining certifications in those boring old "core" codes, when instead they could focus on Green code issues, which are so much more critical to our future existence???


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## Code Neophyte

Duplicate (again, yes - hopefully there isn't a penalty for too many duplicate posts!!)


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## Mech

Pennsylvania does not adopt all of the appendices, Appendix A being one of the omitted!


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## brudgers

mtlogcabin said:
			
		

> _Please forward this email to your organizational colleagues under age 35_,


A chain letter from the ICC?

You're fn kidding me.


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## Jobsaver

Anybody have a guess as to why the age limit?


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## mtlogcabin

I was 35 when I became an inspector & 37 a BO and having seen over 200 applications for employment over 20 years I can't remember one applicant being under 40, Lets face it if they have their health they will make a lot more working in the trades then as a goverment employee


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## Code Neophyte

Jobsaver said:
			
		

> Anybody have a guess as to why the age limit?


Because we're old, obsolete, and "don't get it" - that's why we aren't 'embracing' the green codes and other high priority initiatives of the ICC.  Notice the photographs at the headers of all of the screens on their websites?  Looks like they copied them from a college or university website - everyone in their twenties, well dressed, look like they're on a field trip to a jobsite rather than working there.  Seriously, go to the site and click on each of the main areas at the top of the screen:  "About" / "Communities of Interest" / "Membership" / "Education and Certification", etc. and look at the pictures.  That's how the ICC views us - either as how membership currently looks, or how it "_should_" look.


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## jpranch

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## FM William Burns

> Anybody have a guess as to why the age limit?


Mind control and society's/corporate view of beautiful people


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## Yankee

The link should be send out to everyone and the survey should have included a question about age range. Then ICC could have thrown out the responses from the age ranges they didn't want to know about without looking so asinine.


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## jpranch

"without looking so asinine". Too late for that!


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## Code Neophyte

Look like anyone in _your_ building department?


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## Mech

Unfortunately, surveys can be useless. The intended results can be generated before the survey is even conducted, then they write the question in such a way that their results are guaranteed.

Example:

Interviewer: Would you rather eat Vanilla ice cream or lima bean flavored ice cream?

Interviewee: Vanilla

Survey Result: "Our survey indicates that most people prefer Vanilla ice cream."


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## Jobsaver

I sent ICC the question, "Why the age limit?", but do not really expect a response.

They are probably just targeting marketing dollars where they will get the most return. My recent ahj membership renewal request was apparently forwarded straight to the marketing department, as I am already receiving a new flood of ICC email from the marketing department.


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## permitguy

I'm now 34.

permitguy, shattering stereotypes about age of code officials since 2001!


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## steveray

37 in a couple weeks...started whenI was 34...


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## Jobsaver

I remember 34. I had hair on top of my head instead of on top of my ears.


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## fatboy

LOL......good one jobsaver.....I can relate.


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## mtlogcabin

ICC is conducting a series of in-depth telephone interviews with code department staff under the age of 35 to gain insight into perspectives toward code development. Results from the study will inform ICC's ongoing discussion about how to maximize participation in the code development process. Please consider participating in the study by consenting to participate in an interview and by providing contact information below. The interviews, which will take approximately 20-30 minutes, will be conducted between January 3-14, 2011. If you have any questions, please contact Mike Armstrong, ICC Senior Vice President, at marmstrong@iccsafe.org.

Maybe because those under 35 probably have had no experience or participated in how the legacy codes where adopted.  This will give the ICC a fresh and new way to adopt code changes. Lets see just cram all code changes into one, don't discuss the merits of each individual one and vote. Works for the Senate and House should streamline the ICC process.


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## jpranch

I called Mike Armstrong to find out what this is really all about. We talked for awhile and he sent me this email:

Hi Jim

I’m happy to give you a little more background.  As you may know we have a Code Development Review Ad Hoc Committee, assembled by former Board President Ron Lynn, to discuss how to best evolve our process to encourage greater participation and access.  The CDRAC and the Code Council are very interested in hearing from newer code officials who may just be starting to have the time to participate with us.  Given the advances in technology and the different ways younger generations access information and participate in outside activities, we’d like to know how the Code Council might best be positioned to engage with them as they mature in their careers.  We have sent this request to every listed lead point of contact for a member jurisdiction, some 12,000 individuals, in the hopes that they can help us build a list.  Our immediate goal is to conduct telephone surveys and provide analysis to the CDRAC in a white paper before their last meeting in February.  We also feel this will be the basis for new outreach initiatives designed to “build our bench” of future leaders and participants at all levels.

I’m happy to answer any other questions folks may have regarding the survey, and I appreciate your interest.

Best to you over the holidays –

Mike Armstrong


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## mtlogcabin

> Given the advances in technology and the different ways younger generations access information and participate in outside activities, we’d like to know how the Code Council might best be positioned to engage with them as they mature in their careers.


I feel like I am going in the direction of the slide rule :roll:


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## Code Neophyte

Kind of like surveying the incoming freshman class in their first week on campus about how to improve student life, instead of surveying the outgoing seniors.  Sounds like it's as much about indoctrinating young minds as it is seeking input.

Preferred methods of "accessing information" and communication among various age groups should be universal and not industry- or profession-specific.  The information should be widely available and has undoubtedly been studied much more in-depth and by much more qualified analysts than will be engaged here.


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## jpranch

The information should be widely available and has undoubtedly been studied much more in-depth and by much more qualified analysts than will be engaged here.

Code, that is true but qualified analysts costs a lot of money vs doing it in house. In talking with Mike a large part of this is an attempt to identify the next generation of leaders that will be voting members, chapter leaders, icc board of directors, etc...


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## Yankee

. . . how best to reach the younger generation of code officials , , , maybe start with a FORUM that works?


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## texas transplant

Yankee,

You will get no where if you keep trying to apply logic to this you know.


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## jpranch

Been saving this picture for for a Texan! Enjoy!

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## permitguy

What's a slide rule?


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## texas transplant

permitguy, that's mean there are some of us on here that were trained on and used slide rules before we could afford a calculator.


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## pwood

i was trained on an abacus!


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## Mech

I thought the slide rule was one kid at a time.


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## permitguy

One kid at a time, and always check how hot it is before you sit on it with shorts on!


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## Uncle Bob

Yep,

The ICC is a swell organization.  It asks the old timers that it screwed; to help bring back the Bulletin Board; and build it up; so the new guys will come to their website.

You get the disrespect you deserve; if you go back there.

Uncle Bob


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## conarb

Young kids have been brainwashed by the public school systems into believing in saving the earth and redistributing the wealth to the third world.  We old timers don't buy into it, so they want those already conditioned into believing this crap, and in most of your cases enforcing the draconian regulations.


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## RJJ

The next generation to be brained washed. They know they have lost it with the present code officials. Smart move on the part of ICC. They realize they need fresh blood in the seats to continue thier business plan. We all have paid our dues, bought the books and test and have a pocket full of certs that are worthless if they fold. To keep the doors open, the need a future infusion of cash. If they focus on the under forty crowd they will have an income stream for at least 10 years. Or until they figure out the ponzi scheme.


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## Francis Vineyard

When institutions become too big to fail it creates death panels to survive

Barney


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## Code Neophyte

RJJ,  your last post is dead on.  Well said!


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## fatboy

Yes, unfortunately..............


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## jpranch

Gents, it's not all doom & gloom. Ya, I know I'm an old fart closer to the end than the beginning but geese.


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## Daddy-0-

I'm 38. We have one inspector who is younger than I am but she does code enforcement and property maintenance.

Jobsaver,

Starting to get the hair on the ears......and I am not happy about it.


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## Mule

Wait until the hairs in your nose are longer than the ones on your head!


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## Jobsaver

Now it is becoming crystal clear why the ICC is targeting young folks. It's the hair issues!


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## jpranch

Now this is funny!

I filled out the survey for 35 and younger. Now for those of you who know me, know 35 was a long time ago! So I lied about my age just to see what happened. Received this email today.

Dear Mr. *****,

On behalf of the International Code Council (ICC), thank you for

responding to the survey of younger code officials. As a follow-up,

McKinley Marketing, Inc. will be conducting interviews on behalf of

the ICC to gather your perceptions on the code development process.

ICC would like to ensure that the needs and expectations of young

professionals are considered as they consider potential ways to

enhance the process.

Please let me know your availability, indicating specific days and

times as well as best contact information, to participate in a 10

minute telephone interview between now and January 12. We will

follow up with specifics as we schedule our interviews.

Thank you in advance for your participation, and for the contribution

you are making to the ICC’s future.

Warm regards,

Marti

Marti Campo

Research Associate

McKinley Marketing

202-333-6250 x313

mcampo@mckinleymarketing.com 

www.mckinleymarketing.com


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